Yes, you are shameless - lol
So here is a copy of the response I posted on your blog.
sigh...Actually he's wrong, graffiti being treated as a felony issue is increasing as well as arrests for it. Not just in Ohio.
No Graffiti one of the many sites out there listing information on this issue. Infact in some areas you can't even buy spray paint if you are under 18, some under 21.
Then of course the opposite a Pro-Graffiti website.
Dr. George Kelling in his book Fixing Broken Windows and Dr. Catherine E. Ross, Ohio State University state the following; Residents of neighborhoods do not like graffiti, and they often rank it above drug problems as a crime they would like to see emphasized more by law enforcement.
That's why it is a felony, not just because of those like Mr. Ferner who seem to think their message is such that the law should not be important. It's about respect. If "Debbie" had been caught? She would have been treated the same way as Mr. Ferner, and given the lack of adventure many of our suburban police departments have at night? I'd be willing to bet that many police cars would have shown up for her arrest as well. It's not anything new for that many cars to show up even for a traffic stop in the burbs.
So my intial advice to Mr. Ferner stands, next time? Try a banner, or a sign, most times depending on how you place them they are not illegal.
In addition, I didn't post this on your blog but I would add, that most likely the reason Mr. Ferner was not given a 10% bond or O/R if an O/R release was an option for that charge (did not search it) was because of his previous arrests. Typically if you have been arrested before they are not quite as cooperative nor are they by law required to.
posted by psyche777 at 04:30 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
"Yes, it is a violation of the law to spray paint an overpass, but who’s the real criminal here?"
IANAL, but I'd probably go with Mike Ferner and his brother since he's asking.
I also liked this comment: "This is an example of selective enforcement and selective prosecution," he said. "In a normal graffiti case, the judge would have likely released us on our own recognizance. In our case there was no O/R, and we had to post a $3,000 bond with no percentage; our attorney asked for the typical 10% and the judge said no."
Maybe, just maybe, it's because he was a high profile politician who showed no remorse for his crime and displays a high potential for committing a similar crime while out on bond, not the typical so-scared-they're-crapping-their-pants teenager who normally gets arrested for painting a pot leaf on the water tower? Could be, but again, IANAL.
posted by thenick at 05:06 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
Mike - in your interview Mr. Ferner stated -
“What’s the charge for killing 100,000 dead Iraqis and 2,000 dead US troops, not to mention the thousands of soldiers coming home in pieces and the families destroyed?”
My question is - how do you kill a dead person? I know it's semantics, but it just struck me as odd.
As for Mr. Ferner's reasoning - he's lost. He's just plain lost. How can this man attempt to validate his actions based on anyone's actions other than his own? I'm not a proponent of the war, but just because there is a war going on will not serve as a solid cause for me to commit a crime! It's totally ludicrous!
Perhaps a psych eval would be a warranted exercise at this point.
posted by DoknowDocare at 05:35 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
It's not just him, we have Cindy Sheehan stating she's not going to pay income tax to so many others feeling crimes similar to Mike Ferners as well as lessor misdemeanor charges are all "justified".
It seems to be their mindset, perhaps the way they are rationalizing whatever they do.
posted by psyche777 at 05:59 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
Mike I am glad you posted it. I don't think it is selfless promotion.
Ferner is eerily sounding like Eric Rudolph in justifying his criminal activity based upon his belief that someone is committing a bigger crime. Let us hope he can look back and understand what he did was wrong, NOT technically wrong.
posted by chrismyers at 07:41 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
Thanks Chris, but I'm still a self-pimping whore.
:-}
I don't get as worked up about graffiti; I think there is some merit in recognizing some types as an art form, and a quasi-anarchistic argument could be made that public property can be used by the public.
(Note: just throwing it out there; I'm not advocating that everyone grab a can of spray paint tonight).
As long as graffiti is not obscene, and not on private property, I am less inclined to want the book thrown at participants in this ancient form of protest.
posted by historymike at 08:26 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
Ferner is eerily sounding like Eric Rudolph in justifying his criminal activity based upon his belief that someone is committing a bigger crime.
Argument using Bad Analogy.
This debate tactic creates an equality where none exists. The argument depends on the connection between two unrelated items, or in this case, two persons with very different crimes.
About the 'lesser crime/bigger crime' scenario: if this were a legal argument, the precedent has already been established in the Jim Crow Laws in many of the southern states in the 1960's. The lesser crime [civil disobedience] was ruled justifiable to counter the bigger crime [segregation].
posted by limedrops911 at 08:30 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
Although I generally like Mr. Ferner (not all of his positions), I think that he loses this one by justifying his own bad behavior by pointing out the bad behavior of others that have gone unpunished.
posted by corky at 08:38 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
Well I spouted enough on that aspect on Your Blog so anyone who wants to read my volumes of comments can go there. Does that count as pimping your blog or pimping my comments on your blog?
lol
:-)
posted by psyche777 at 08:39 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
That makes you a codependent blog-pimper. You are an enabler, Lisa, in my quest to pimp my blog.
posted by historymike at 08:45 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
Sigh...I wonder if there is a 12 step program...
:-)
posted by psyche777 at 08:47 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
Since Mike Ferner likes to write, has it occurred to him to start up a blog?
Ann Arbor resident Xavier Nuez exhibited his Alley and Fire Escapes photography at the fall Artworks of Toledo show in the SeaGate Centre. Some cool stuff. He was interviewed by NPR in November.
Maybe Ferner can claim he's an artist waiting for a photographer.
posted by jr at 09:04 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
Lime,
The comparison has more similarity than what you think. When one begins justifying criminal activity by saying someone else is a bigger criminal (as Ferner has actually said), that person begins down a path of escalation. I am sure Rudolph never considered murdering people at one point and through his internal processes he began escalating to the point he began justifying criminal activity. Then small criminal activity becomes larger and larger and before you know it you are shooting people you think deserve to die and planting bombs. Everyone agrees that Ferner has many other options that are not criminal to get his point across, thus there is no justification for what he did. Being there are so many other ways to get your point across, he is beginning to go down the road that Rudolph commenced down.
I am sure graffiti is not easy or cheap to remove, and the last I checked we all need to pay through higher taxes to have it removed. If you love the art, paint your basement or your walls in your house; don't deface public property with it.
posted by chrismyers at 10:18 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
It costs America more than $8 billion per year just to clean up graffiti.
http://www.sanantonio.gov/graffiti/thefacts.asp?res=1024&ver=true
posted by psyche777 at 11:04 P.M. EST on Tue Jan 03, 2006 #
Yeah, awesome example there Ferner.
“Yes, it is a violation of the law to spray paint an overpass, but who’s the real criminal here?” Gotcha, so two wrongs do indeed make a right?
“Technically I broke the law. But let’s compare that..." Translation: Yes, I'm wrong but let me try to change the subject so my actions seem justified even though I knew they were wrong.
I might have been able to respect what Ferner did (even if I don't condone it) if he'd proudly accepted the punishment as a small price to pay for what he believes. Instead he chooses to whine about being caught and attempts to justify his actions by citing the actions of another. Not a smooth move, Mike.
-Dan
posted by photodan at 12:15 A.M. EST on Wed Jan 04, 2006 #
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