30 years ago people were complaining about enclosed malls being built instead of having shopping downtown. Now people are complaining about enclosed malls being torn down and being replaced by open-air malls. Investors are doing this for a reason, and it's because they have done their homework. They know this is where the new development is going to be.
This would be the best thing for Northwood if your goal is Best Buy, Marshall's, Border's, etc. They are far more likely to locate in this style of development instead of building next to a run-down, infrequently visited shopping mall.
posted by HeyHey at 10:51 P.M. EST on Wed Aug 30, 2006 #
Best Buy (yes we need one for the eastern region of NW Ohio)
No, you don't need a WorstBuy. There's now one and a goddamn Sam's Club, may the Waltons burn in Hell for all eternity, in Sandusky.
The *welcome* addition is Target. Target was in fact NICE enough to scrap the old K-Mart and locate there.
posted by anonymouscoward at 12:59 A.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
No, you don't need a WorstBuy. There's now one and a goddamn Sam's Club, may the Waltons burn in Hell for all eternity, in Sandusky.
Yes, they do. There is no electronics retailer on the east side of the river. I know, the salespeople are annoying and the Geek Squad service is manned by some workforce fringe players, but Best Buy is a much better store than Circut City. Circuit City is the only store I've ever seen where the employees outnumber the customers, yet you still have to wait in line to check out.
posted by thenick at 07:53 A.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
Is the owner of Woodville Mall the same one that owns the old Northtown. When will everyone learn the owner only uses these malls as a tax write-off. They could care less about what they are doing to our city. Hell, they don't live here, work here, shop here. I say the city should TAKE these malls by Eminent Domain.
posted by Judy at 08:15 A.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
thenick, I was responding to this line:
Best Buy (yes we need one for the eastern region of NW Ohio)
Far as I'm concerned, you have two in Toledo already, plus if I recall correctly two Circuit Citys. So what if they're all on the west side of the river? And, yes, for the record, I swallowed my pride and applied for the Geek Squad online, twice, and never heard a damn thing back, thus proving that WorstBuy only wants to hire complete pushy morons to provide bad service at outrageous prices. I can pretty much do everything they're supposed to be able to do, except things like lie convincingly with a smile on my face, be overly condescending without developing a pained expression, and manage to wear a necktie without developing a psychsomatic itch from its presence. Oh, and charge obscene sums of money for fixing problems without feeling the least bit guilty about it.
I, personally, am just counting the days until Borg*Mart buys and tears down the Food Town or old Hills store there by Woodville Mall and plunks down another SuperCenter. Seems pretty likely to me.
posted by anonymouscoward at 11:12 A.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
There is no electronics retailer on the east side of the river. I know, the salespeople are annoying and the Geek Squad service is manned by some workforce fringe players, but Best Buy is a much better store than Circut City
We do have ABC warehouse, while it doesn't have as much as best buy they do have some stuff. I hate circut city, best buy doesnt have any good movies, the music they play is extremly annoying, so i would only go to best buy to buy a computer, and i dont need one right now. I miss media play, they had cool movies, AND books. Now a barnes and nobile would be a good place for the old hills store. or even a target.
posted by tm at 11:23 A.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
I was one of the first people in the WM when it opened and I've lived 5 miles away from the mall for 35 years. My kids learned to run AND Christmas shop in that place, and my husband practically supports Andersons single-handedly! :)
I'm so glad they're remaking it instead of closing it and walking away, like Northtown/Southwyck. I'm so sick of seeing empty buildings everywhere and WM was one of the emptiest. Can you imagine the cost of heating and air-conning that behemoth in this day and age?
Opening it up to the outside might even make it cheaper per foot for the retailers and we can get some new and interesting shops over here. I'd love for Target, Barnes and Noble, Best Buy, ANYBODY, to move into Hills and Foodtown (why doesn't KROGER'S do that instead of putting their new store BACK into Great Eastern that wasn't good enuff to stay in back in the day!?? Is Woodville Rd getting that much more traffic now? *gripe* *mumble*)
Anyway, good job, Woodville Mall Owners, for sticking with us all this time and for not sticking us with another dead elephant!!
PS--ABC Warehouse sucks and I'm sure the theatre and the parking lot will both benefit from the mall upgrade. Wait for it......
;p
posted by nana at 11:55 A.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
and my husband practically supports Andersons single-handedly
What is it about men and andersons, my hubby practically lives there. 8-)
I even learned how to drive in WM's parking lot.
posted by tm at 12:25 P.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
I hate circut city, best buy doesnt have any good movies, the music they play is extremly annoying, so i would only go to best buy to buy a computer, and i dont need one right now.
I went into a Best Buy on a Saturday looking for an HDTV. I found the one I wanted, 50" LCD made by Panasonic, for $3,199. I went back with my van the next day, Sunday, and found that TV was $3,499. I got the manager and told him I'd been in there the day before and it was $300 less. He told me the price had been "corrected."
I went to Circuit City down the street. They had the same HDTV for $2,999. I bought it. The salesman all but chased me out into the parking lot while trying to sell me a 3 year service contract for another $500.
Also, you're right about the music at Best Buy. Hip Hop at 120 dB is intended for whom? ... The middle-age folks right next to the music section looking at washers, dryers and $1,200 refrigerators?
posted by YakRider at 01:02 P.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
They could care less about what they are doing to our city. Hell, they don't live here, work here, shop here. I say the city should TAKE these malls by Eminent Domain.
That might be the worst possible and least plausible economic development idea I've ever heard. Please do me and the rest of the metropolitan area a favor and never run for office. Ever. If you're truly serious about using eminent domain in this fashion, please stop voting as well.
Far as I'm concerned, you have two in Toledo already, plus if I recall correctly two Circuit Citys. So what if they're all on the west side of the river?
For anyone living in Oregon or Northwood, it may be just a few minutes difference between going to the Secor Best Buy and the Sandusky Best Buy. As for ABC Warehouse, if you think the Best Buy salespeople are jerks, try dealing with their sales reps. Plus the entire store smells like new fridges.
And, yes, for the record, I swallowed my pride and applied for the Geek Squad online, twice, and never heard a damn thing back, thus proving that WorstBuy only wants to hire complete pushy morons to provide bad service at outrageous prices.
Believe me, you don't want to work there. Unless you enjoy getting paid near-minimum to help Grandma recover the digital photos of her cats, they probably did you a favor.
posted by thenick at 04:06 P.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
I say the city should TAKE these malls by Eminent Domain.
Are you serious? Fortunately that's now illegal....thank you Ohio Supreme Court! That would arguable be the best way to scare off even more businesses than we do now. And don't forget that it would be incredibly expensive to do that. It would cost millions for Northwood to acquire that land and millions more to tear it down. For some reason I don't Northwood has that kind of money.
posted by HeyHey at 06:41 P.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
anonymouscoward,
Are you from Sandusky? I was just there for a class reunion last weekend and couldn't believe how built up rte. 250 is since I've last been there (1992). I did notice that Target moved in where the old Kmart was.
posted by Kevin at 07:59 P.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
Are you from Sandusky?
No, I'm just unfortunate enough to live over that way.
posted by anonymouscoward at 08:07 P.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
Ah, yes. The Woodville Mall. This was the mall that was soooo well run that a couple of years ago now they had a tenant running a secret catering business out of the back doors of their closed restaurant that was allegedly being remodeled all that time (hence, to my understanding, not paying rent or paying diminished rent -- the details are hazy now for me). This secret tenancy was probably from the pre-Kahan (sp?) era.
As for the "management" -- the Krone group is a pack of incompetents who are only doing what incompetents do best: they emphasize style and use constant change to hide their inability to manage. As was my prior understanding, management under the Krone group involved steadily leaning on tenants in order to up-scale the area. Small or non-national tenants were being blatantly discouraged from continuing their tenancy, and in their place national outlets were being wooed. (Sound familiar? *cough*Westgate*cough*)
Well, I'm not sure what's happened with all that. If their wooing failed, I'm not surprised. The Woodville Mall is in the sticks as far as Toledo-area malls are concerned. A lot of investment energy has already been allocated to other projects in the area -- those being primarily Franklin Park, Levis Commons, and a large number of strips that are STILL being built. Where investment energy was expended, the consumers have followed.
If enough customers show up to the party at Woodville, then the Krone group's incompetence may well pass muster in all the flurry of commerce. I'm not a betting man, but I don't predict that one.
Judy said: "Is the owner of Woodville Mall the same one that owns the old Northtown. When will everyone learn the owner only uses these malls as a tax write-off."
Since they lost about a million on the deal (inasmuch as I can tell from news reports), then that's a hell of a tax write-off.
Judy said: "[The mall owners] could care less about what they are doing to our city. Hell, they don't live here, work here, shop here. I say the city should TAKE these malls by Eminent Domain."
Eminent Domain is largely used against the poor. Taking the mall away from some Californian rich people will only result in lawsuits that will either create enormous litigation costs and/or a truly elephantine settlement package. On "economic development" alone, there's no way a municipality can prove (facing expensive lawyers) that taking the mall away would be an economic advantage ... unlike razing a few homes. Few people in America believe that poor or working-class homes are an economic advantage, since we so deeply hate the poor and the working classes.
posted by GuestZero at 10:04 P.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
On "economic development" alone, there's no way a municipality can prove (facing expensive lawyers) that taking the mall away would be an economic advantage ... unlike razing a few homes.
Even if they could prove that it's good for economic development emminent domain could not be used. At least in Ohio. The Ohio Supreme Court ruled on that recently. The only way they could use emminent domain would be for infrastructure improvements for the common good such as a road, and that's not going to happen.
posted by HeyHey at 10:41 P.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
While a lot of shops in Franklin pk Mall (yes, I still call it that) are nice (and expensive) - I hate malls in general,and avoid them whenever possible. Money and time eaters, parking is always a headache, within 20 minutes I am frantic to get the hell out (now where is the entrance I came in at?). I figure my time counts for something and malls just eat hell out of it. I guess if you have a few hours to kill and enjoy that sort of thing, go at it. I prefer stores where I can park fast (and close), get in and out fast, and be on my way. I love the Andersons and go there every week - one big store that has a lot of stuff. Same with Target. Although I hate Meijers - slowest checkout in town, and I waste too much time and money.
I too miss Media Play - would love to see one in the Shoreland/North end. And A Barnes and Noble maybe.
What I never understood, was why nobody's opened a Chick-Filet (sp) in the Point Shoreland, or Monroe street area - WITH a drive through if possible, but mainly one that you did'nt have to enter a mall to get to. Imagine that.
posted by starling02 at 11:52 P.M. EST on Thu Aug 31, 2006 #
I get your point, well taken! But what I have said from the get-go is these Malls need is Brand New Stores, not just more of the the same. How about a Burlington Coat Factory, a Trader Joes, a Waffle House at Alexis and I-75. And think long term after the new bridge is open and we can get to WM from Alexis and Telegraph area faster than we can to Franklin Park Mall (Yeah, I still call it that also). I said this about Northtown years ago, we need stores that are not now in this area. Like a Sonic Drive-In Restaurant and so many more.
posted by Judy at 08:02 P.M. EST on Fri Sep 01, 2006 #
On I-75 North there is Manufacturers Marketplace - loaded with shops. Anything that goes into Northtown has to be different than the ones off the xway - just too close. I have never eaten at a Sonic - my daughter and her friends decided after seeing so many tv commericals for it, to make the long drive to go to one. They were hugely disappointed. Alexis has too many fast food places as it is - the exception I'd make would be a Chik Fil A. We could use a fried chicken place though.
Across the street from Northtown on Telegraph are a number of empty store fronts - empty for years - one is huge. Doesnt seem like much lasts there. I thought the Pier One was a great idea but it left.
posted by starling02 at 09:42 P.M. EST on Fri Sep 01, 2006 #
I am old enough to remember the day the Woodville Mall opened...I was a Freshman in highschool and it was an exciting thing...a MALL! With that on my side of town!
WE crowded that Mall..until...Franklin Park opened...myself included...
When the E-way is open over the River...I can travel as quickly to Franklin as to Woodville...Franklin always offerred more...thus...I went to Franklin...
I would love to see Woodville grow into a thriving Shopping Place...whether it be a Mall or Plaza...
From what I have read...Elder Beerman, Anderson's and Sears would remain...more than I expected to be honest...there are times one doesn't need two hands to count the amount of customers...
posted by MARIELORA at 08:37 A.M. EST on Sun Sep 03, 2006 #
Instead of carrying on and on about something no one has any certain details about... Why don't you contact the krone group and/or get your information first hand. Go to www.thekronegroup.com, then KRONE1, then under the Cleveland ext., go to property listings and click on the Woodville Mall and see the upcoming development plans for the leasing company.
posted by chicasteph at 10:16 A.M. EST on Thu Oct 12, 2006 #
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