Oh, for crying out loud!! This is the stupidest story I ever heard. However it is a wonderful diversion from the problems at One Government Center caused by the folks The Blade supported.
Want to get The Blade to stop doing this kind of stuff? Announce that for one planned weekend their biggest advertisers (Dillards, Meijers, Kroger, etc.)will be boycotted. Give the stores a call too. It's not like The Blade would report it. It's really just that simple. If that doesn't work do it again. Or, on a particular Sunday, request the Blade to stop your delivery for that day so the ads don't get read. Once again let the advertisers know. It doesn't take much to start a revolution. And Lord knows there's getting to be a lot more space along the Maumee River to hold a tea party.
posted by thinkingwoman at 09:49 A.M. EST on Thu May 12, 2005 #
Word on the street - Noe loaned a pen to Speaker of the House Jon Husted a few weeks ago.
Not just any old 12-for $.99 Dollar Store pen. A clicky-type pen, maybe costing as much as $2.99. Graft! Corruption!
And Husted failed to declare it! Let's get another investigation going; perhaps the IRS can audit both men and chase them down for tax fraud.
Fight da power!
posted by historymike at 10:11 A.M. EST on Thu May 12, 2005 #
Ye gods! We can only thank our lucky stars it wasn't G.W. Bush who was served pretzels on Tom's couch. Ah yes, I can see the headlines, just as it read a few years ago.
"President George Bush choked on a pretzel and fainted onto the floor."
"He cut his face and bruised his lip in the fall, but the White House doctor, Richard Tubb, said he was fine now."
posted by jamsmitty at 11:24 A.M. EST on Thu May 12, 2005 #
He said he did not disclose it to the Ohio Ethics Commission because he felt he paid market value for the stay.
ohhh pleaseeee he didn't realize that renting even an apartment cost more than $100.00 a night?
granted the pretzel part is silly though serving pretzels without beer should be a crime it isn't
posted by psyche777 at 01:27 P.M. EST on Thu May 12, 2005 #
Here's a really wild suggestion.
Stop supporting the two-party system.
Here's another one.
Stop electing powerful people with ties to other powerful people. Hire someone who has too much integrity to use others as a stepping stone to political office.
I swear that Ohio's copying all the worst attributes of Florida and California and refining them.
We have Ken "Ohio for Bush" Blackwell running for governor. Like Jeb gave Florida to Bush.
We have Jerry Springer running for governor. California's fine tradition of TV and movie personalities running for office.
If it's not Republican graft, it's union-demanded stupiditiy. If it's not the Democrats failing to do what they promised, it's the Republicans.
Stop electing people who surround themselves with butt-kissers and kiss the butts of more powerful people in order to get a handout.
I'd like to see one of you folks grow a pair, go down to the Board of Elections, and get the forms and stuff for running for office. Surely y'all aren't dumb hicks who can't put a pen right way round on a piece of paper?
Afraid to change things from the inside?
posted by anonymouscoward at 02:02 P.M. EST on Thu May 12, 2005 #
...you think he paid for the rental with some old coins? ;)
posted by timault at 02:20 P.M. EST on Thu May 12, 2005 #
HA HA!!!!!!! I'm lovin watching little tommys' world come crashing down on him!!!!!!!!!
Him and his butch wife are garbage.
posted by HarveyBrooks at 06:05 A.M. EST on Fri May 13, 2005 #
HarveyBrooks- Please tell us what the Noe family did to you.
You must be quite a hit at parties with your elegant locution and well thought out insights.
posted by maverick at 08:51 A.M. EST on Fri May 13, 2005 #
Agreed.
I may not like all of Noe's politics, but I try to keep the discourse at a civil level.
Harvey, you are not required to follow my suggestions about cyber-manners. You might, however, want to read the guidelines that jr set up:
http://www.toledotalk.com/cgi-bin/postingguidelines.pl
Besides, it is more fun to skewer with intelligent rhetoric than to slam someone WWF-style.
posted by historymike at 09:48 A.M. EST on Fri May 13, 2005 #
OOPS!!!!! So sorry for expressing my opinion in such an ineloquent manner. I shall henceforth engage in only civil discourse and shall attempt to abide by the rules of proper conduct so as not to offend the more sensitive participants in this spirited debate.
posted by HarveyBrooks at 10:55 A.M. EST on Fri May 13, 2005 #
Ya know - I just checked out another thread titled "The Blade Gets It's Way..." in which someone who goes by the name of jr. uses expletives and insults other posters. Could this be the same jr. that wrote the "guidelines"?
posted by HarveyBrooks at 11:21 A.M. EST on Fri May 13, 2005 #
What expletives and insults? You mean Starfucks? Sometimes I get my b's and f's conbused.
posted by jr at 02:31 P.M. EST on Fri May 13, 2005 #
Look.
You can post any way you wish. This is not a "sensitivity" issue as much as it is an "intelligent debate" issue.
Personal attacks take away from the merits of an argument.
When you write of loving "tommy's world come crashing down on him," or his "butch wife," the site is dragged down to the level of every other crappy blog and chat room. There are some I just won't visit anymore because they are dominated by idiots trying to out-flame each other.
Starbucks, however, deserves any and all ill will that you wish to dish. Look closely: you can see the AntiChrist in their logo. (Sorry, had to tweak the conspiracy nuts and fundamentalist wackos).
Of course, any company that can figure out how to get dupes to pay $4 or more for a cup of brown liquid can afford the abuse, as they laugh all the way to the bank.
posted by historymike at 04:42 P.M. EST on Fri May 13, 2005 #
So my post expressing(in an admittedly sophomoric manner)satisfaction that a corrupt political operative is being held accountable for abusing his access to power "drags this site down to the level of every other crappy blog and chat room."
OTOH, the guy who wrote the rules can call people losers and use profanity to express his point of view and you consider it "intelligent debate" and it conforms to your definition of "cyber manners."
I guess it's just coincidence that you agree w/jr.'s view & disagree w/mine.
"Starbucks, however, deserves any and all ill will that you wish to dish"
Now thats somethin I think we can all agree on.
posted by HarveyBrooks at 08:11 P.M. EST on Sat May 14, 2005 #
Just to put things in perspective... The guy who wrote the rules also pays for the web hosting so you can be a guest on his site.
I'm not speaking out in favor of Mr. Noe but are you calling him corrupt because it's your opinion or because it's fact? I understand he's still under investigation for possible fundraising violations. Has he been found guilty?
-Dan
posted by photodan at 09:59 A.M. EST on Sun May 15, 2005 #
Just my opinion after looking at the publicly available evidence and observing how he's worked over the years.
Has he been found guilty?
Not legally, yet - but he's certainly guilty of being ethically challenged.
Is there any question that he bought access to politicians through campaign contributions and then used his access to power to enrich himself?
What do you think the chances are that Taft&Co would have entered into such an unusual and risky business venture with Mr.Noe if he happened to be a Democrat?
Is there any question that he hired a felon to play with taxpayers money?
As for the fundraising violations, how does the Federal investigation fit into the Blade conspiricy theories?
posted by HarveyBrooks at 12:59 P.M. EST on Sun May 15, 2005 #
DUH!!! Any business person who doesn't join organizations or use a network of some sort doesn't stay in business very long.
Ever known anyone who got a ticket fixed or got a special discount at a restaurant because they knew somebody or worse yet stayed at a friend's house in Florida and failed to pay the "market rate"? They are envied not held up for ridicule.
Would everyone be all worked up if he met customers through Rotary, Chamber of Commerce, the Moose Lodge? It has been established that people who network make 80% more money than those who don't.
He didn't hold a gun to Taft's head. If in fact this was an extremely risky investment why the heck are we blaming Tom Noe?
posted by thinkingwoman at 08:40 A.M. EST on Mon May 16, 2005 #
The condo thing, in my opinion, was a non-issue and shouldn't have merited a Blade story, let alone a front-page story.
I am amazed that Noe was paid anything; in a way, I am almost heartened that they at least put on the veneer of legitimacy by paying hundreds of dollars for the use of the Florida Keys place. Most corruption does not involve the recipient actually paying something resembling a normal price for the object.
Heck, the way the Blade carried on, I would have expected that Noe would have given the condo away for free, or left a grocery bag full of cash for Brian Hicks to take home with him.
What a waste of ink; must have been a slow news week for JRB.
posted by historymike at 12:19 P.M. EST on Mon May 16, 2005 #
but he's certainly guilty of being ethically challenged.
This is what escapes me. Obviously, I too am ethically challenged (perhaps severely) because, honestly, I don't see a single shred of unethical behavior in any of the facts that have come out so far. The implications and inneundo, maybe. But not the facts so far.
Is there any question that he bought access to politicians through campaign contributions and then used his access to power to enrich himself?
First off, yes there is question. Unless I missed something, there is no proof that he got the job because of his contributions.
Second, even if he did, what does it matter? Did his contributions and work in both political and private organizations help him to get to know, build relationships with and gain the trust of people in state government? Of course. What do you want to happen? That is reality and there is nothing wrong with it. Would you rather they invest in someone they don't know and don't have a working relationship with? Would that make it "ethical"? With all due respect, I think that would make it stupid.
What do you think the chances are that Taft&Co would have entered into such an unusual and risky business venture with Mr.Noe if he happened to be a Democrat?
You’re proposing two things here. The answer to the first is yes. I know that they would have entered into such an unusual and risky business venture because that is the definition of alternative investments. The managers of the BWC allocated a small portion of the total fund to invest in high risk/high return ventures. That portion would have been allocated and invested with or without Noe. And I hope it continues without Noe because it is prudent investing.
The answer to the second question is “who knows”. Was there a democrat with the same or better qualifications looking for the job at the same time as Noe? I’m pretty sure that answer is “no”. If that’s the case, what are we saying? That “Taft & Co” is guilty for what they “might have” done in a different situation?
Is there any question that he hired a felon to play with taxpayers money?
He made a mistake. So what? This issue is at the level of micro inspection. It is one decision of many that he made in several years. The balance of those decisions were obviously good based on the financial performance overall.
Micro inspect any of the thousands of other businesses that are funded with the other $14 billion in the fund and tell me if you don’t find any bad decisions. I think you’ll find a lot of bad decisions because most of them are not providing a return.
If you really want to evaluate his business skills, consider the fact that Noe immediately confiscated $500 thousand of their assets and withheld another $900 thousand in commissions.
As for the fundraising violations, how does the Federal investigation fit into the Blade conspiracy theories?
Maybe it is related, maybe it isn’t. There is one thing for sure, though: nothing has been proven yet. Let’s wait and see.
posted by babbleman at 01:12 P.M. EST on Mon May 16, 2005 #
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