It does no good to laugh at any man when he's down. Because he's a skillful politician, and possibly a dangerous one. They don't call him "The Hammer" for nothing! Those cockroaches in Texas never stood a chance when he was on the job! It's not only the liberals who are afraid of "The Hammer", his own fellow Republicans fear his power and influence.
Here's a somewhat liberal view of the man. A little older link, but I believe it captures the general feelings of many liberals.
http://www.slate.com/id/9739/
Here's a more conservative view of him.
http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/rice200503230745.asp
posted by Bbcmjeep43 at 09:15 P.M. EST on Mon Dec 05, 2005 #
he's a skillful politician, and possibly a dangerous one.
Indeed a danger...to all of America. Just think of all that he has done to our democracy, especially the state of Texas. He is the worst kind of politico-- he's in it for himself and his buddies. He doesn't give a damn about America and the citizens of our nation.
He's that wolf in sheep's clothing especially his phoney patriotism. But then, he's typical of a lot of phoney patriots mascarading around as 'true' Americans while, behind closed doors, they are nothing but self-indulging looters of our treasure, both monitary and human.
He is just the proverbial tip of the corruption ice berg. Perhaps America's citizens are finally waking up to the scum who have been screwing Americans for decades while all the while pretending to be such good politicians and such patriotic citizens.
posted by limedrops911 at 09:30 P.M. EST on Mon Dec 05, 2005 #
This case is starting to fall apart like I predicted
posted by lloyd at 09:36 P.M. EST on Mon Dec 05, 2005 #
It should be noted that the more serious charge of money laundering was upheld - meaning there is enough evidence to try Delay.
Why does every Republican run to this guys defense? There's bad apples all over politics, why defend this one?
posted by rusty at 10:43 P.M. EST on Mon Dec 05, 2005 #
This case was baseless, and I doubt this will ever see trial. There's actually been a few reports that the Democratic party did the exact same thing, so to say this isn't politically motivated is just plain dumb. Just because he's known as "the hammer" doesn't mean the judicial system should be used against him without regard for truth and justice.
He sounds like most politicians that get things done...he's tough, ruthless, and unwavering. Is it good for the country? I don't know....if the programs they're supporting are good for America then maybe. But think how many politicians are just like him on both sides both past and present....Hillary, FDR, Newt, GWB, Mayor Daly, etc., etc., etc.
posted by HeyHey at 10:45 P.M. EST on Mon Dec 05, 2005 #
well limedrops911-I'm with you except there is dirt in every party- some dems and some reps arejust plain corrupt....some of us just don't agree on who they are and why.....lets face it POWER corrupts....Hell I see it at the Local level here within the local school board-AND the union,the administration.....it is like a disease....some folks just can't handle it....it matters not to me what party the person is from....if they break the law there should be something done about it.....period....I think Clinton AND BUsh both broke the law-over different things but never the less they did...one lied about pussy the other lied about why he sent us to war...the Bush lie is much worse to me...HIs lie about WMD has gotten how many killed now?....a lie about oral sex and a cigar...who the hell did that hurt?and who cares.....please....ok so he lied about it.... stupid thing to do-he should have looked the American people in the eye and said "This is between me and my Wife....and god knows she could care less...if she did she would have left him,but again with that power thing...she needed him to get what she wanted,why she is still with him ,I do not get that at all...but to each his own....he is one sexy man to me....I'd do him IF he were single!
posted by divamom26 at 12:52 A.M. EST on Tue Dec 06, 2005 #
Diva, we've already determined that your accusation against Bush is foundationless.
Why not traffic in reality for once, hmmm?
posted by WhiteAfricanAmerican at 03:51 P.M. EST on Tue Dec 06, 2005 #
Divamom,
I am not a prude and enjoy a dirty joke from time to time. But your language really has no place in any serious discussion of any kind. As a favor to me, could you comport yourself as an adult?
Thanks.
Clinton could have hurt the criminal justice system. Let's take a look at the argument on Clinton's behalf.
The allegation against Clinton is that he perjured himself before a federal grand jury. Democrats argued that it was ok that he lied because the charges were scurrilous and he didn't think it was right that he should have to do it.
So, if I'm called before the grand jury, and I don't think I should be there, perjury is permissable. That would destroy the underpinnings of American jurisprudence.
posted by MemyselfandI at 05:26 P.M. EST on Tue Dec 06, 2005 #
Actually HeyHey this WILL see the trial. Unless Delay plea bargains - which I would assume would wreak havoc on his reputation.
That's what the actual news was yesterday, not that the conspiracy charge was dropped but that enough evidence was presented to warrant a trial on the money laundering charges.
Ruthless and unwavering don't seem like good qualities for a politician to have to me.
Go to opensecrets.org and take a look at some of his campaign contributors. They also have a feature that shows correlation between Congressional votes and industry donations. Interesting stuff, feel free to look up a shady Democrat or two - they're out there as well, no doubt.
posted by rusty at 05:46 P.M. EST on Tue Dec 06, 2005 #
OH GODS NOT CLINTON AGAIN!
Clinton lying about receiving a blowjob wasn't perjury, because it wasn't relevant to the investigation against him.
Ask a goddamn lawyer instead of repeating the same old lies.
http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-clintonperjury.html
http://www.slate.com/id/1002007/
I am sick of posting this. Get a goddamn education already.
posted by anonymouscoward at 06:35 P.M. EST on Tue Dec 06, 2005 #
Let's see, AC...Since Clinton lied to a grand jury about something that wasn't relevant to the investigation, it's okay...
do you feel the same for Scooter Libby? He's accused of lying about certain facts before the grand jury, but some speculate (don't know for sure because the grand jury testimony hasn't yet been released) that what he got caught lying about had nothing to do with the investigation.
When you apply your same standards to everyone and not just to those "evil republicans," then you'll gain some credibility for your opinions....
posted by intrepid at 07:36 P.M. EST on Tue Dec 06, 2005 #
Boiling Clinton's criminality down to "lied about oral sex" is a tired old line of crap resurrected from not only 1997 in particular, but about every 5 minutes in general.
The general allegations against the Clintons was long enough to be hair raising. Are we going to belittle those too? Foster, TravelGate, FBI files, China connections, Whitewater, leftover allegations from various Arkansas chicanery involving criminal sexual misconduct ... well, if anyone actually listened to Ken Starr, it was me, and the case was certainly made that there was faaaaaar too much smoke to ever suggest that there was no fire. I hardly need to google the details. You all can do that on your own.
Bill Clinton's supporters even went to jail to avoid incriminating him. Does every big-L Liberal insist that that meant nothing?
In moderation, Clinton's illegal activities (for which in part he's been disbarred and fined, which is another set of facts that people like to forget) were really more or less in line with Presidental misconduct throughout the years. Reagan, for example (and an example I love to choose since Republican hardliners support him with equal religious fervor, as the Democrat hardliners support Clinton) was well into illegal and immoral wars and arms movements behind the scenes using the usual suspects amongst his subordinates. There's really nothing dissimilar between Col. Oliver North and Abu Ghraib's B.Gen. Janis Karpinski.
The term "wag the dog" got a great deal of popular exercise during the Clinton years. It wasn't just the movie; it was the Clinton tendency to bomb and missile various places (primarily the Middle East, what a shocker) when something like a dress stain was in the news. Who really can call that moral behavior ... I mean, all parts of it? Who can really say such a man was morally qualified to hold the land's highest executive office?
To oppose the terrible example that Bush presents, the Democrat loyalists would be well served to stop bringing the sludge of the Impeached President to the surface. Clinton didn't serve the idealist Democrat principles. Hence, as an example, he's largely ineffectual when juxtaposed with Bush. It's not just about blowjobs and bombs. It's about integrity, respect for America's Constitutional founding, and the strict observance of Human rights (those being summed up by "don't bomb them"). Measured that way, Clinton is a Bush clone.
posted by GuestZero at 08:50 P.M. EST on Tue Dec 06, 2005 #
Intrepid,
If Scooter Libby lied to a grand jury, even if he wasn't the alleged leaker, he should stand trial for perjury and receive an appropriate sentence. so to answer your question: yes.
Anonymous coward,
I'll ask you the same question I asked Sil: Can a reasonable person disagree with you, or do you somehow have a monopoly on correct opinions.
The link you provided is somewhat biased I think. I'm pretty sure that lying to a grand jury under any circumstances constitutes perjury.
posted by MemyselfandI at 09:21 P.M. EST on Tue Dec 06, 2005 #
National Nitwit has the exclusive story of new charges faced by Tom Delay.
National Nitwit - we get the news from which everyone else runs screaming.
posted by historymike at 10:13 P.M. EST on Tue Dec 06, 2005 #
Me...
I, too, agree...but you note that A/C has yet to answer my question to him as well as yours.
posted by intrepid at 08:46 A.M. EST on Wed Dec 07, 2005 #
Neither Sil nor the Anonymous Coward have answered the question. Their silence speaks volumes.
posted by MemyselfandI at 08:14 P.M. EST on Wed Dec 07, 2005 #
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