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Smoking Ban is Amended - Contrary to the bombastic claims by some that smoking bans are “sweeping the nation” and that this amendment would easily fail, Issue 4 passed.

I’m well aware of what swept the nation last night…and it certainly was not an assault on private property rights or a sneer at the free market.

It was nice for a change to have the citizens decide on an issue that the liberal elite was trying to shove down their throat by avoiding a public vote (much like a similar issue that got cleanly sent in all 11 states in which it was on the ballot).

What they've really done is set Toledo back 20, 30 years…
You got it right, David Grossman, back when the last embers of the greatest generation’s sense of personal responsibility were being stamped out by the baby boomers.

We put forth the health argument, which was the factual argument. But sometimes the facts don't prevail…
Jack Ford is telling his citizens that they are stupid.

…health groups and anti-smoking advocates will focus efforts on reaching out to bars and restaurants who have gone nonsmoking and encouraging them to stay that way.
YES. PLEASE DO. Why didn’t they think of this earlier? Making a difference, changing the world, beating the system - whatever you want to call it – always involves changing people’s minds. Be persuasive, put up a good argument and, most of all, move others to change. Somewhere liberals lost this concept and thought the shortcut was to simply force their ideas on the public by lawmaking.

In this case, if they would have channeled the same amount of energy into convincing people not to go to smoking restaurants, they would have been a lot more successful and would have truly made a change. Instead, to borrow their own term, they now find themselves in a quagmire of a half-baked ban.
posted by babbleman to politics at 9:35 P.M. EST     (7 Comments)

Comments ...

98% of Toledo's restaurants will remain smoke-free, correct?

This ammendment primarily affects bars and bowling alleys. And it's up to the owner of those businesses to allow smoking again. I bet some stay smoke-free. It's finally their decision.

Less than 30% of Toledoans smoke, but over 50% voted for the ammendment. What's that saying? Where's the analysis on that fact?

Our illustrious mayor said, "This will water down the overall impact of the ban. It troubles me personally"

Mr. Mayor, Toledo's original so-called strict smoking ban was already watered down. Mr. Mayor, you exempted private clubs. Mr. Mayor, how come you weren't troubled by the workers and non-smoking patrons at private clubs? Could it be that higher-ups from the Blade and some of your campaign contributors hang out at private clubs?

Passing Issue 4 is not only a vote for the rights of some business owners, it was also a vote against the propagandistic Blade.

Somebody should send a first aid kit to the Blade. They've got to be in a little pain after their guy Kerry got beat and now their smoking ban will be ammended. Although the Blade can find some comfort with Kaptur winning and Lucas County still mostly controlled by Democrats.

The Blade probably doesn't like the fact that democracy worked for Issue 4. How dare the public go against the Blade. Think of it as a compromise. Restaurants are smoke-free, and bars can allow smoking.
posted by jr at 09:35 A.M. EST on Thu Nov 04, 2004     #

Less than 30% of Toledoans smoke, but over 50% voted for the amendment. What's that saying?

The smoker percentage is of the entire population whereas the voter percentage is of only those who voted. I'm still not sure what it means, but I think it is possible that a vast majority of those that voted to amend were smokers. Not that I think they were, but it is possible. It would be interesting to know that stat. I'd like to think that the amenders were non-smokers and that they were open minded enough to understand the big picture.

Somebody should send a first aid kit to the Blade.
Oh, man you’re not kidding. On president and smoking ban they got slammed. Basically the king and queen of the election. However, Lucas county was still one of the five dark blue counties in Ohio. Of course, what would have really been sweet is if Kaptur would have went the way of Daschle.
posted by babbleman at 10:31 P.M. EST on Thu Nov 04, 2004     #

Speaking of first aid kits, I wonder if Chaz is going to come back. I certainly hope so. He hasn't been on since Monday evening. For the last four or five months, three days off would be almost unheard of. The cool thing about him was that he always, without fail, had the last word.
posted by babbleman at 11:08 P.M. EST on Thu Nov 04, 2004     #

I'm glad that you missed me so much babblebubble. But I can hardly see reality through all of the smoke (and mirrors) here.

I'm so happy to live in a town where people support the right to kill others with their second-hand smoke (and carry their legal assault rifles for protection and target practice). And I'm so pleased that that those bar owners will now be able to hire hundreds of new workers (remember that Issue 4 was needed to save all of those high-paying great-benefit jobs). Yes, you conservatives have convinced me that we should do whatever we can to get government off our backs. Here's to 4 more years of war, pollution, tax breaks for the wealthy, gay-bashing, guns in everyone's pockets and backbreaking deficits (who cares since it will be our children and grandchildren that will have to slave away for it later?). Here's to 4 more years of that great diplomacy insuring that America will continue to be hated by the vast majority of the world's population! Who cares if millions of Americans lack health care? Since they are poor, they don't deserve it anyway. At least we still have our God-given right to smoke until our lungs are black and our coronary arteries are blocked. Praise ye all conservatives for keeping America safe from those evil gay people and those insessant liberals who want to steal your cigarettes!
posted by Chaz at 03:20 P.M. EST on Tue Nov 09, 2004     #

Hey! Chaz is back! And with him he brings all of the negativity, tired stereotypes and hatred that the majority of the country kicked to the curb last Tuesday. Will they ever learn?
posted by babbleman at 10:36 P.M. EST on Tue Nov 09, 2004     #

I love you too babblebumble. But your character attack digresses. Each year more and more countries, states, communities and towns enact laws that prevent smoking in public places and workplaces. If you think that the continuing widespread enactment of smoking legislation is going to reverse course, I want to discuss some land in Iowa with you. Smoking kills. Most communities already understand that. Those that don't, will. This has nothing to do with employer rights or alleged loss of jobs. Even of there was a loss of jobs (which did not happen in California), which is more important, jobs or life?
posted by Chaz at 09:50 P.M. EST on Mon Nov 15, 2004     #

"Smoking kills."

That's an erroneous blanket statement. Some people live into the 90's, and they smoked and drank nearly every day of their lives. Genetics has a play. Smoking doesn't kill everyone.

The proper thing to say is smoking definitely increases your chances of getting a major ailment like cancer, and it increases your chances of getting the flu and cold. That all leads to people missing work, a drop in productivity, and a drain on the health care system.

But the same thing can be said of our eating habits. Genetics, once again, is a factor here. A bad diet doesn't kill everyone, but a bad diet does increase your chances of getting a major disease and other illnesses like the flu and the cold. And it's a drain on the health care system.

It's the second hand smoke that anti-smoking people rally around. A Big Mac doesn't harm anyone except the person eating it, right? Wrong. Every taxpayer pays for obesity-related illnesses, and the amount paid is going up every year. You can consume soy crumbles and drink wheatgrass shots every day and be the healthiest person in the world, yet you are being harmed in your bank account and in your health plan by people stuffing french fries down their throats.

If 30% of Toledoans smoke, I'm going to guess that more than 30% of Toledoans consume junk food. I'm going to go out on a limb and claim that more kids consume junk food than smoke.

So let's have it. Let's bring on the government legislation that controls what we eat. Let the government manage all grocery stores so the food we buy can be controlled and monitored. Tax junk food. Let the government monitor our weight. If we're overweight, we're given time to lower it, but if we fail, we pay a fine. How about a federal exercise program?

Tobacco is the leading cause of death among preventable diseases. Obesity is number two, but obesity is expected to surpass tobacco. Therefore, bring on the government controls, the lawsuits, and the $6 Big Mac. Mr. and Mrs. bloated government, please make us healthy, because we're too stupid to know better.

To the boneheads in Toledo government, here's a plan to help get some money to offset your budget deficit: Implement a Twinkie tax. Tax all junk food sold in Toledo. Think of the revenue you could collect.
posted by jr at 11:07 A.M. EST on Tue Nov 16, 2004     #

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