Toledo Talk

FYI: Buckeye Express Users -- Consumption FAQ

A Internet Consumption FAQ was added to their webpage www.buckeyecablesystem.com/express (right hand side under Web Documents). Here's a direct link to the PDF: http://buckeyecablesystem.com/express/icp-faqs.pdf Let the replies start...

created by smbfc on May 03, 2012 at 09:53:53 pm     Technology     Comments: 51

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Wooooooowwwww.... I have a feeling they're going to lose a lot of customers who have a home-based business.

posted by dell_diva on May 03, 2012 at 10:13:56 pm     #   1 person liked this

We'll be looking for other options and I only used 70GB last month.

I'm glad they deregulated the cable industry; all that competition has really driven down costs and given us lets of options...<\sarcasm>

posted by SensorG on May 03, 2012 at 10:21:31 pm     #  

What other options are there? I would LOVE to get away from Buckeye but last time I shopped around I didn't find anything that would suit my needs. I dropped my cable through them but stream a lot of video and bet I'm about to be bent over because of it.

posted by WalleyeWinger on May 03, 2012 at 10:45:57 pm     #  

Unfortunately every ISP will do this eventually. Streaming music and video (and to a lesser extent gaming) use so much bandwidth compared to anything else. I know ATT UVerse hasn't mentioned consumption fees so it is likely a safe option. I for one am a fan although the installation process can be long and painful for some people for some reason.

posted by taliesin52 on May 03, 2012 at 10:49:57 pm     #  

Off hand, here is a good explanation on why bandwidth caps/rate increases are garbage:

http://www.cringely.com/2011/07/bandwidth-caps-are-rate-hikes/

posted by taliesin52 on May 03, 2012 at 10:54:45 pm     #  

Note how phone through them (that uses the SAME data path) does not count against the data caps, but from another provider does? Illegal bundling and product tying, anyone?

posted by anonymouscoward on May 04, 2012 at 01:12:26 am     #   2 people liked this

I would love to get away from Buckeye too. The whole data cap thing is just another rate increase, but it's a hidden one. It's to keep from having to upgrade their internet services so instead of them paying money for new hardware and technology, they keep what they have and punish the customer by limiting their data. Can't they just go after those who are abusing it and just do that to them, why do it to everyone? I wish there was another high speed internet service though that was better than them in the area.....

posted by Xavier97x2 on May 04, 2012 at 04:21:53 am     #  

?? I am as serious an internet user as anyone I know and I can easily fit under these caps. Daily Xbox live, streaming audio, watching movies now and then...and I will not come close to the cap.

No need to whine.

posted by Star56 on May 04, 2012 at 05:24:33 am     #  

Star56 posted at 05:24:33 AM on May 04, 2012:

?? I am as serious an internet user as anyone I know and I can easily fit under these caps. Daily Xbox live, streaming audio, watching movies now and then...and I will not come close to the cap.

No need to whine.

Agreed, unless you are a business user, file sharer, or are just online 24/7 you will be hard pressed to hit the cap. I do Xbox once a week for a couple of hours, our household watches 10 hours of netflix/hulu a week and we don't have any issues.

If you use suck up more of their service than the average user than you should pay more. If we all paid an equal amount why should someone who uses more of the resource pay the same amount? Yes I agree Buckeye is a monopoly that needs to be broken up, but I see nothing wrong with this. You play WoW 12 hours a day or file trade GBs of data than pay for it.

I find most of the people moaning about this are the ones using the most of the resource and don't wish to "pay their fair share" of the cost. They find it acceptable that the average user help suck up their cost.

posted by dbw8906 on May 04, 2012 at 06:16:52 am     #  

So, when watching a Netflix movie at peak hours and the buffering is so bad the stream goes from HD to low resolution... Or when downloading a file at peak hours and we find our selves waiting way too long... Or when we pay for xxx amount of bandwidth but every time we use their provided bandwidth tester and find we're getting much slower speeds than promised... Will we get a credit? Only seems fair

posted by upso on May 04, 2012 at 06:48:31 am     #   4 people liked this

Two thoughts:

Upso said he pays for xxx. TMI. :D

Dam one and a half percenters. :D

posted by justread on May 04, 2012 at 07:24:44 am     #  

Upso I watch most of my Netflix a between 7 & 9 and have never had a buffering or HD problem. But then again I have not been file sharing the latest movies all day long either. (not that you do)

The lack of competitor is the real problem, I can't even try other service providers due to buckeye's lock on the market. I more than agree if you are not getting the speeds you pay for then something should be done.

"Paying your fair share" of a resource you get more benefit from than everyone else has long been a tent pole idea of the Democratic party. Why should I pay more to upgrade a backbone service when I don't press the system as it is. That cost should be burdened by those who allocate more of the system, sounds like a pretty "progressive" idea to me.

posted by dbw8906 on May 04, 2012 at 08:25:55 am     #   1 person liked this

The issue is, we've been paying a premium price for YEARS, so essentially we all pay for it anyway. Now instead of investing the money to keep their systems up to date, theyre just going to penalize everyone.

posted by SensorG on May 04, 2012 at 08:35:00 am     #   3 people liked this

dbw8906, we live in the old west end, and I suspect we may just have some aging lines coming into our house. we've never had the data stream promised in our bills. check this link to see if you're getting stiffed as well.

http://speedtest.buckeye-express.com/index.html

posted by upso on May 04, 2012 at 08:47:34 am     #  

Love the disclaimer that says it really doesn't indicate your speed.

posted by Molsonator on May 04, 2012 at 09:10:46 am     #   1 person liked this

Is there a way I can go back to the last 6 months and see what my usage was?

posted by Molsonator on May 04, 2012 at 09:14:29 am     #  

I play Battlefield 3 online frequently, I stream movies from Netflix, and I checked. Last month I was at around 27GB.

posted by JeepMaker on May 04, 2012 at 09:26:02 am     #  

Can you get Comcast yet in Toledo? I agree - we need better alternatives to Buckeye. As a quasi monopoly, the rates just keep going up and up.

posted by toledoramblingman on May 04, 2012 at 09:33:21 am     #  

Cable companies are afraid that people will drop the cable service (their bread and butter) for options like HULU/ Netflix? Roku?Google TV, and streaming game systems. So they want to impose caps to limit our desire to drop them. Even stranger there is now talk of HULU requiring you to sign in with or attach your account to your cable/ dish provider to watch HULU (personally I think its a huge mistake, but that is the direction they are supposed to be heading). http://www.mobiledia.com/news/141806.html

posted by roygbiv on May 04, 2012 at 10:50:27 am     #  

Don't go ballistic until you check the usage ceiling on your plan and compare it to your monthly usage. I don't think I could exceed my maximum usage.

posted by madjack on May 04, 2012 at 11:26:18 am     #  

I'll say it again as a former customer of Buckeye's for 35+ years---People who complain they need options need to do some research on the options. I have Time Warner now and the channel offerings are a joke compared to what we were getting with Buckeye and I pay $15 more a month. The Son has ATT just for his phone and has had nothing but problems with service, he's looking to go with Buckeye. I've had friends and family who have had Dish and Comcast due to living in non-Buckeye areas, and they all came back to Buckeye as soon as they could, the most recent one switched this week.

Once you have to actually live with another service, you understand just what you are getting for your money with Buckeye. We always had great service, and great channels, since day one.

Paying for going over the cap is the way to make the people using more bandwidth pay for more bandwidth, it's as simple as that!!

posted by nana on May 04, 2012 at 11:41:35 am     #  

Having heard a lot of my out-of-state friends vent about Comcast, I'm not sure it would be any better than Buckeye.

There may be a better cable company out there somewhere - I just don't think it's Comcast.

posted by mom2 on May 04, 2012 at 12:01:22 pm     #  

Comcast is nightmarish. Good luck with their service. I've dealt with them many times on my sister's behalf up in MI and it has been some of the most frustrating time I've ever spent.

As for Buckeye not upgrading their systems - completely not true. Buckeye has invested heavily in their infrastructure to modernize it and keep it cutting edge. As one who had DirecTV for 9 years and DISH for two, IMHO, Buckeye is far superior. And you won't save any $$ with the satellite operators either and may even pay more.

All that being said, do I like paying them $180/month for my services - HELL NO. IMHO, when you look at their overall offerings and their 2nd to none service AND they're local - employing local folks - that all counts for something. Do I think they need some serious competition? You bet. You also need to look to your respective cities and townships - they're the ones who control what company gets the cable monopoly.

There are far too many factors involved (many out of Buckeye's control) for them to be able to guarantee your actual Internet bandwidth. I've found in off peak hours, I'm pretty much getting what I pay for - 15mbps.

As for Internet consumption, those who use 100x more than I do should pay more for it IMHO. Why should I subsidize them? This isn't insurance after all.

posted by Foodie on May 04, 2012 at 12:19:57 pm     #  

I've had Comcast, Charter, Time Warner and Buckeye throughout the last 10 years or so. Buckeye was by far the best in pretty much all categories.

posted by researcher on May 04, 2012 at 12:25:49 pm     #  

I'd be curious what my useage has been the past month. I don't even have cable but use Netflix a lot + online gaming.

Can see a cap being rough. Often there are Steam sells or even free demo's you can play but heck they are 3-4gig each. So there goes a nice slice of your allotment for the month just to play a demo.

posted by INeedCoffee on May 04, 2012 at 12:26:41 pm     #  

Looks like I'll have to manage internet activity at the house. I have the 15Mbps package and I'll be allocated 250GB of bandwidth per month. Last month, I checked in at 199.3GB - yikes. This is lots of YouTube, MLB.tv, XBOX Live, Smartphones (2), and Skype.

posted by odnation on May 04, 2012 at 01:15:20 pm     #  

I telecommute to work... so this is going to be an issue.

posted by toledolen_ on May 04, 2012 at 02:24:34 pm     #  

Netflix, hulu+, streaming Amazon, Skype for meetings, uploading and downloading files from the office Dropbox... etc, etc.

:/

posted by toledolen_ on May 04, 2012 at 02:25:53 pm     #  

How do we find out what our actual usage has been? I don't see it on the bill (unless I am just not looking in the right place!)

posted by shamrock44 on May 04, 2012 at 02:37:31 pm     #  

@Shamrock...

https://myaccount.buckeye-express.com/UserLogin.cfm

posted by odnation on May 04, 2012 at 03:11:26 pm     #  

http://www.buckeyecablesystem.com/index.html

->Internet
->Member Services

posted by jbtaurus98 on May 04, 2012 at 03:20:55 pm     #  

Thanks!!!

Never saw that before.

They have a nifty test on there that measures your upload and download speeds and also a spot to check your actual usage.

posted by shamrock44 on May 04, 2012 at 03:45:45 pm     #  

Funny, it worked from home.

Permission to access denied
We are sorry, but from work I get -

Error: We're sorry. Permission to access membership services has been denied. For security reasons, we are temporarily blocking access to this account. If you feel you have received this message in error, please contact our Help Desk at (419)724-9800. Our Help Desk is open from 24 hours 7 days a week. You may try to access your account later.

I'll try it from home again later...

posted by SensorG on May 04, 2012 at 03:52:11 pm     #  

and here I thought I was going to have to cut back on my Toledotalk Mexican Restaurant posts. Whew. Got plenty of room.

posted by Molsonator on May 04, 2012 at 04:04:21 pm     #   3 people liked this

TTers. Does anyone know what the $2.75 fee is for T-essential Feature Set - TEL FEATURE-REPEAT DIALING?

It shows up on my Buckeye Bill but I don't have phone service with them.

posted by Molsonator on May 05, 2012 at 08:35:12 pm     #  

This sounds reasonable, I am a heavy user work + gaming + I netflix every evening for background noise and last month I only used 97gigs. So 250 sounds fair.

Think it's just the ideology of going from a all you can eat buffet to 4 plates stacked, you might only eat 2 but like the idea of eating 6 if you really wanted to. :)

posted by INeedCoffee on May 06, 2012 at 05:46:57 pm     #   1 person liked this

I'd be interested in knowing how (if at all) heavy users really affect the end price of everything. Though without solid stats from Buckeye, it's hard to know. Is this due to bottlenecks at the nodes or at the edge to the transit Internet pipes? If nodes were the bottleneck, I would think DSL would have no data caps then, but they do.

Transit Internet bandwidth limits is a bit hard to believe. Let's see who Buckeye gets their internet from. I'm guessing the only networks on that list providing transit are Level3, Qwest and Cogent. The Qwest link might be an old DS3 left over from Access Toledo though it may have been upgraded since then. Level3 and Cogent are the big players here. I know that Cogent though is pretty cheap bandwidth. If you had a 10gig line from Cogent at $5k/mo, you could stream 2000 Netflix HD shows simultaneously, but you would only need the monthly fees of 167 users to pay for it (assuming they're all on a sale plan on a low tier). I have a VPS that I pay $15/year ($1.25/mo) for and I get 500GB per month bandwidth on a 1Gbps port. I can buy extra bandwidth for $2.50/TB. Or roughly 13 cents for 50GB which Buckeye wants $10 for. Granted that's a bit more competitive bandwidth market (San Jose). Still, I would doubt Buckeye's costs are 77 times more expensive.

posted by FKnight on May 09, 2012 at 07:52:15 pm     #  

FKnight posted at 07:52:15 PM on May 09, 2012:

I'd be interested in knowing how (if at all) heavy users really affect the end price of everything. Though without solid stats from Buckeye, it's hard to know. Is this due to bottlenecks at the nodes or at the edge to the transit Internet pipes? If nodes were the bottleneck, I would think DSL would have no data caps then, but they do.

Transit Internet bandwidth limits is a bit hard to believe. Let's see who Buckeye gets their internet from. I'm guessing the only networks on that list providing transit are Level3, Qwest and Cogent. The Qwest link might be an old DS3 left over from Access Toledo though it may have been upgraded since then. Level3 and Cogent are the big players here. I know that Cogent though is pretty cheap bandwidth. If you had a 10gig line from Cogent at $5k/mo, you could stream 2000 Netflix HD shows simultaneously, but you would only need the monthly fees of 167 users to pay for it (assuming they're all on a sale plan on a low tier). I have a VPS that I pay $15/year ($1.25/mo) for and I get 500GB per month bandwidth on a 1Gbps port. I can buy extra bandwidth for $2.50/TB. Or roughly 13 cents for 50GB which Buckeye wants $10 for. Granted that's a bit more competitive bandwidth market (San Jose). Still, I would doubt Buckeye's costs are 77 times more expensive.

Nice little link there. And the City of Toledo gets all their IP from Buckeye?

posted by anonymouscoward on May 09, 2012 at 11:55:19 pm     #  

I don't know what the deal is with the City and Buckeye. I do know that Buckeye got a 30 yr. exclusivity contract with the Village of Holland roughly around 1992 or so to be the only cable provider allowed to operate in that area.

In exchange were promises of a low rate of any future cost increases for Village users. Also in exchange was a dedicated cable public service channel available for use by the Village to broadcast civic events and council meetings etc. Its been a while but I also seem to remember that the Village got some pennies per number of Buckeye customers.

Buckeye's argument was that they put in the infrastructure - cable - and why should another cable operator come in and use the Buckeye infrastructure for free. Of course the village has never used that free channel. No money or expertise to buy and operate the equipment to neessary to broadcast. Buckeye must have laughed its butt off when they inked the deal.

That's why there has been no other cable provider in this service area. It was also why Buckeye for years did nothing to upgrade their programming or equipment. They had locked out the competition. And then came satellite TV and Hey Howdy! Buckeye had competition and started losing customers. Then of course, they embarked on a program to upgrade services and equipment.

That contract will expire someday. I just hope that the elected officials make smart and PUBLIC decisions about negotiating or entering entering into another agreement. More than likely Buckeye has a similar contract with the City of Toledo.

posted by holland on May 10, 2012 at 08:29:17 am     #  

"That contract will expire someday. I just hope that the elected officials make smart and PUBLIC decisions about negotiating or entering entering into another agreement." - elected officials & smart decisions don't belong in the same sentence.

posted by dbw8906 on May 10, 2012 at 01:20:51 pm     #  

https://www.facebook.com/SayNoToBandwidthCapsOnBuckeyeCablesystem

posted by upso on May 10, 2012 at 03:38:55 pm     #  

The fact that Buckeye is still in business shows you how brain dead most of NW Ohio is. I had Comcast in Northern VA and that was the only provider I had that was worse, which ironically was just as much of a monopoly as Buckeye has been in NW Ohio.

I had ATT in Michigan, it wasn't bad. I've heard all good things from people with FIOS, regardless of what part of the country they are in.

Currently I am in an area that is only serviced by Time Warner. It's not bad, best I've had by Cable Companies. I was the happiest when I had DirecTV but that was the most expensive because I still use a LAN line phone.

I have heard about Hulu and their deal with the cable companies, makes me glad I never purchased Hulu Plus. Redbox is about to come out with internet streaming as well. Crackle.com is also expanding very quickly.

posted by MikeyA on May 10, 2012 at 04:23:00 pm     #  

The fact that Buckeye is still in business shows you how brain dead most of NW Ohio is.

We're brain dead because the only choice we have is Buckeye? When was the last time you even lived in NW Ohio? Im not unhappy with Buckeye's product and service, but they are expensive and they are looking for ways to nickel and dime us for more.

Im still waiting for the increased competition and decreased costs that we were promised with deregulation of the cable industry. We were promised the same when they deregulated the power companies too

posted by SensorG on May 10, 2012 at 04:34:03 pm     #   2 people liked this

Just did a quick search of my parents home not far off of Heatherdowns and they can't get FiOS (Ohio and Michigan not yet) but they can get AT&T Uverse and the satelites on top of Buckeye. That's a lot of competition for Buckeye being the only choice.

posted by MikeyA on May 10, 2012 at 07:55:56 pm     #  

I never understand people when they say Buckeye CableSystem has a monopoly. Any company, Time Warner, Comacast, etc... can come in and build their own network to provide service. Most don't though because it's usually not cost effective while another MSO is entrenched within an area. Just like another city may be all Comcast, because no other company wants to overbuild. While I don't necessarily agree with bandwidth caps, unfortunately that is where all residential ISP's are headed.

posted by jashansen on May 13, 2012 at 07:39:44 pm     #  

Jashansen-its not just residential services that are being capped, I received notice that my business account will be capped as well.

posted by roygbiv on May 14, 2012 at 07:11:43 am     #  

Jashansen-its not just residential services that are being capped, I received notice that my business account will be capped as well.

posted by roygbiv on May 14, 2012 at 07:11:44 am     #  

Jashansen-its not just residential services that are being capped, I received notice that my business account will be capped as well.

posted by roygbiv on May 14, 2012 at 07:11:44 am     #  

When you say business class do you mean just cable modem + static IP or their fiber link connection? I will need to follow up on this since I use both.

posted by INeedCoffee on May 14, 2012 at 07:57:24 am     #  

ineedcoffee, I have a cable modem +static IP. My business uses buckeye for both internet access and phones. I know the phones don't count in bandwidth, and I'm really not to worried about going over the limits most months but there are some months that I gobble up bandwidth on side projects.

posted by roygbiv on May 14, 2012 at 02:24:25 pm     #  

roygbiv - I understand, but my comment was more towards the people that say Buckeye CableSystem has a monopoly.

posted by jashansen on May 14, 2012 at 05:28:32 pm     #