A A A A Search :
Toledo Talk   (musing about Lake Erie West and beyond)
From jr's workspace   

Here's why other communities laugh at Toledo

--> Toledo has too many dolts masquerading as public officials.

Just in the past week :

1. Mayor Carty gets fined for parking in handicap spot.

2. Mayor Carty leaves his dog in the vehicle in hot weather.

3. Less than three days later, mayor Carty leaves his dog in the vehicle again on a muggy morning.

4. Councilman Szollosi proposes legislation to ban pets in city vehicles. As if Toledo does not have any other problems.

5. Councilman Ludeman throws a hissy fit because Maumee residents were going to get five dollars off admission for one day of a rib festival. A frigging rib festival. Never mind all the county money that funds Toledo projects. But oh man, give Maumee residents a break on something as trivial as ribs, and the political pissants in Toledo act like the world is ending. And last August and this August, the dumbasses in Toledo have scheduled their own rib-off the week before the Northwest Ohio rib-off, which is no doubt done to undermine the one at the fairgrounds.

6. Szollosi plans to knock Ludeman from his council presidency position even though Ludeman is term-limited out in only five months from now. Szollosi blames the Republican Ludeman for the Democrats' childish behavior.

7. Brian Schwartz, Carty's spokesman, has announced that he will no longer be blogging. This is an actual news story. I guess it's a sad loss to the blogosphere. Let's have a mock funeral service, sort of like what was done for the N word.

These people are pathetically small-minded and petty. They're all embarrassing. Why would other communities want to do business with the bozos that exist in Toledo?

created by jr on Aug 10, 2007 at 11:53:47 pm     Comments: 23

print      source      versions      backlinks

tags: moronism   

Comments ... #

i would hope other communities would want to do business with toledo because for totally different reasons than if our mayor leaves his dog in his car or not
come on. give me a break
these examples you give have nothing to do with our city as a whole.

posted by upso on Aug 11, 2007 at 01:33:28 am     #



"... for totally different reasons ..."

Yeah, like what? I asked the question: Why would other communities want to do business with the bozos that exist in Toledo? and you couldn't provide an answer, upso.

upso, you're missing the big picture here, aren't you? The same person who has no concern for an animal and no concern for the law is the same person who just a few weeks ago made himself and Toledo look foolish by falsely accusing Wood County of 'poaching' jobs from Toledo. So we shouldn't be surprised, I guess, when the above stupid actions take place and will continue to happen.

Once again, for upso's benefit, a look back at the Perrysburg Messenger story:

Toledo mayor derails possible regional cooperation

The administrator said a joint meeting with Toledo officials was scheduled to take place yesterday, July 24, but was terminated after the mayor's comments. "He derailed it on Friday."

Mr. Hrosko said the purpose of that meeting, which was arranged prior to Mayor Finkbeiner's public statements, was to discuss development of a joint economic development zone (JEDZ) for the Ampoint site.

From the WTOL story:

The mayor accused Wood County of previously pirating, raiding, pilfering Toledo companies. He cited O-I, which moved more than a year ago from its downtown Toledo world headquarters to Levis Commons in Perrysburg.

Lane Williamson, chairman of the board for the Wood County Economic Development Commission, told us O-I approached Wood County, not the other way around. He says the commission is in a healthy competition with Lucas County, not raiding businesses.

Has the Perrysburg meeting been rescheduled? My guess is it has or will be because the Perrysburg officials are above the fray.

posted by jr on Aug 11, 2007 at 05:46:05 am     #



wow, jr, when you list all those things together...wow...

posted by MaggieThurber on Aug 11, 2007 at 07:29:21 am     #



I was trying to find out cities with similar problems with its political leadership but so far I haven't. Maybe I just haven't looked enough, or there is nothing to compare with Toledo when it comes to a politicla morass. Like a friend of mine piped up when a supervisor said we had the worst sick leave record in the region: We're number one! We're number one!

posted by oldsendbrdy on Aug 11, 2007 at 09:39:39 am     #



jr, i totally see where you are coming from
i just think the dog thing is an insignificant event in the scheme of things

your second post is much more useful in regards to why other communities would want to work with toledo officials

posted by upso on Aug 11, 2007 at 09:52:14 am     #



The dog thing is insignificant by itself, except for the dog, of course. But it's who was involved that matters. It's the thinking or lack of thinking by the mayor of a mid-sized city. If it was the first nutty thing the mayor did, then it would not an issue. But we know the mayor has a long record of ridiculous behavior.


But I would say Crudemans's fit over the Northwest Ohio rib-off is worse. We know Ludeman carries the pee bucket for Czarty. So it's possible that Ludeman was speaking on behalf of Carty.

The rib-off fiasco is nearly two years old. Past Toledo Talk topics:

August 5, 2005 - Why I will never attend the rib-off - with a comment that pointed to a Sep 15, 2005 WTOL story

A Toledo summertime tradition could be making a move. After 22 years in Promenade Park, organizers of the Rib-Off say the grills may have to go. Organizers say ongoing construction projects could make it hard to hold the festival along the waterfront. One site being considered is the Lucas County Rec Center in Maumee. This year's Rib-Off winner says that would be fine with him. "I think the Lucas County Rec Center has some advantages for the ribbers -- more area to work with, a little more freedom of space. You can space everything out properly," said Mister Beefy's owner Chris Frick. He also says parking would be easier at the Rec Center.

Another comment in that thread pointed to an Oct 4, 2005 Toledo Free Press story

The Northwest Ohio Rib-Off, a fund-raising event for United Health Services, intends to move its annual event from Promenade Park in Downtown to one of three locations. Patty Mazur, director of events for United Health Services cited ongoing construction at the Steam Plant and the news of park renovations as reasons for seeking a new venue. Mazur said she has met with representatives of the Lucas County Recreation Center, Toledo Speedway and Northcoast Motorcycles to discuss the event’s needs. She said a commitment announcement should be made mid-October. Mazur wants the event to draw upwards of 500,000 people. In August, the event drew 90,000.

Notice how it's called the Northwest Ohio Rib-Off. It wasn't the Toledo rib-off, and it's not now called the Maumee rib-off. I'd like to know why officials from Wood, Ottawa, Fulton, and other northwest Ohio counties aren't demanding free admission for tomorrow also.

Anyway, in 2006, Toledo turned this rib-off thing into a competitive issue. Toledo officials took this move personally. Toledo saw this as Toledo versus Maumee. And instead of Toledo continuing to support the Northwest Ohio rib-off that supports a charity, Toledo created its own rib-off. Why Toledo didn't create some other kind of unique, downtown festival as a replacement for the rib-off is beyond me. What a blown opportunity.

OK, so we know Toledo has no creativity to invent another downtown festival besides a rib-off. When did Toledo schedule their version of the rib-off? Was it two months before the Northwest Ohio rib-off? One month before? One month after? No. It was the week before. The Toledo excuse machine will say it has something to do with the scheduling of the rib vendors. Nonsense. That's why you create some other kind of festival.


The other Toledo Talk topics:

Oct 7, 2005 - Rib-Off Revisted

Mar 8, 2006 - City of Toledo Rib-Off

Jul 16, 2006 - Up coming rib events, Toledo or Maumee or both

Aug 10, 2006 - Northwest Ohio Rib-Off


My comment from Jul 16, 2006:

This rib-off fiasco is a small example of why other communities don't trust Toledo nor want to work with Toledo on unigov/regionalism ideas. The downtown rib-off moved to Maumee. Instead of Toledo working with Maumee to promote the region, Toledo decides to create its own to compete with Maumee. So much for co-operating with other communities. Toledo doesn't yet grasp the concept of Lake Erie West.

Toledo only thinks of itself when it starts talking about the benefits of unigov or regionalism. If Toledo cannot work with another community on something as trivial as a rib-off, how can Toledo be trusted to work fairly on more complicated projects?

Complicated projects like negotiating Joint Economic Development Zones with other communities.


I'm not familiar with the details of Carty's first two terms as mayor, so maybe someone else can verify the interesting excerpts from this June 2005 posting by gorilla titled Carty Must be Rolling Over in His Grave.

Carty must be rolling over in his grave with this talk of regionalism. Oh yes, I know he's not completely gone yet and with the horrible job that Jack has done, Carty might be back again. Carty was the man who slapped at neighboring cities blaming them for the woes of his beloved city. He slapped Perrysburg, Sylvania, Oregon and all of southeastern Michigan. Didn't he blame realtors for the steering people away from buying within the city limits?

Where some cities have seen the value of collaboration, Carty saw something else, only God knows what. Jack just appears to be overwhelmed with what needs to occur within the city limits, let alone within a region. When the word "region" is used, it usually means cities within a specified 100 mile radius. Oh-oh! Detroit is just 66 miles away. Wasn't it Detroit that Carty slapped so loudly before the end of his tenure.

Maybe the message here is it's time for a new face with greater capacity and a more dynamic vision. Toledoans need to start looking now, if they want turn-away from the from the current iceberg.

So did Carty "slap" other communities in the past? If so, then his latest slap against Wood County last month qualifies to be termed "Carty being Carty," which means Carty is no longer responsible for his actions, and we can view Carty's behavior as being cute.

posted by jr on Aug 11, 2007 at 11:31:58 am     #



I have to admit I went to the "rib-off" downtown to see the "Recall Carty" people in person, but I didn't. I did have a couple of good samplings of ribs (which I write about in Old South End Toledo Musings, see the listed blogs), but it was rather quiet. Did they have a good donnibrook at the one in Maumee yet? Did Tom Morrissey get man-handled again? Any reports on the one in Maumee? Surely somebody has put something on some blog about it? Or wasn't it just not memorable?

posted by oldsendbrdy on Aug 11, 2007 at 12:07:24 pm     #



Have any of you ever seen a manager put out to pasture in a company? In such a state of uselessness, he creates makework for himself and others, and becomes a very petty person to work with.

Well, the same principle applies to politicians. We obviously have too many. In one way of looking at it, Toledo doesn't need to shift to a weak-mayor form of government; it needs to shift to a NO-mayor form of government. There's no rational reason (in light of the past decade's agony) why a simple 7-person city council can't be elected, and one of their number sit as the council Chair to perform so-called mayoral duties.

posted by GuestZero on Aug 11, 2007 at 03:15:38 pm     #



we should abolish local government altogether and board up Gov't center as a social experiment. See what happens.

posted by thetoledowire_com on Aug 11, 2007 at 03:41:21 pm     #



Hey OSEbrdy...I can come to the old south end..we lived on the 200 block of walbridge before moving here. Name the day and time :-)

posted by Chad on Aug 11, 2007 at 07:25:22 pm     #



Chad, I'll probably do it when I go to my brother's. I have to go by Alexis so I'll just zip over to the petition drive there. They doing it tomorrow?

posted by oldsendbrdy on Aug 11, 2007 at 08:00:08 pm     #



Bitch, moan, bitch, moan. Got any SOLUTIONS?

posted by justareviewer on Aug 11, 2007 at 08:04:04 pm     #



Here's a possible solution for you: 1.) Apparently, it's called a moving van:

Toledo's population loss since 2000 was the 10th-fastest among 258 U.S. cities with populations of more than 100,000 people. Toledo's population fell from 313,782 residents in 2000 to an estimated 298,446 last July, a loss of 15,336 people, or 4.9 percent. The new estimate means Toledo's population declined by 2,839 people one year - from 301,285 in July, 2005.

In a June 2006 story about Toledo's continual population decline, Frank Szollosi said something sensible:

"It's an indication that taxes are too high in Toledo."

So that's another solution for you: 2.) Elect people who won't waste taxpayer money and won't raise our frigging taxes. But the reality is, solution two is fantasy.

posted by jr on Aug 11, 2007 at 08:21:06 pm     #



I would think it is an indication that there isn't employment in Toledo. Unless you have believe in yourself enough to start your own business (and people believe in you enough to buy from you) the employment that is out there doesn't rival that of other areas. Of course, it could be an indication that taxes are too high in Toledo, too. If we could just get taxes down to zero we could be the most attractive city to go to, and the least attractive to live in, in America.

posted by oldsendbrdy on Aug 11, 2007 at 09:38:40 pm     #



Justareviewer is part of the problem. We already TOLD HIM the solution: less government and fewer taxes. The Expansionists never accept that solution; to them, messes are solved with even bigger messes.

As Toledo shrinks and its population averages down to poverty, the Expansionists will probably succeed in imposing more government and more taxes since a smaller, poorer population is less inclined to resist such attacks.

So we just end up with marginal concerns. As Jr pointed out, a MARGIN of people in Toledo will wise up or give up, and MOVE AWAY. The minority will be saved thereby; the remaining majority will just sit and suffer, causing a huge need for law enforcement. Toledo is about to enter an age of freely brandished rifles and pistols. The Expansionists want it that way.

posted by GuestZero on Aug 11, 2007 at 10:40:15 pm     #



OSE....I left a mesg w/ Tom to find out. I dunno right now..if not, we're right here all day pal..and I will come to you if you like.

posted by Chad on Aug 12, 2007 at 07:06:46 am     #



OSE.... You can download and print your own copy(s) of the petition from the www.recallcarty.com site. You cannot sign the petition you are the petitioner for. You can print 2 copies and have a friend or family member be the petitioner, you sign theirs, they sign yours etc. You cannot wittness your own signature. Just call or email Tom or I and we can arrange to pick it up. You don't have to have a full page to turn it in. Several people get 205 signatures a page..that's fine. It's the end total that counts.

posted by Chad on Aug 12, 2007 at 07:13:58 am     #



If anyone has any questions on the procedure, feel free to contact me on my cell..567-249-8542

posted by Chad on Aug 12, 2007 at 07:16:54 am     #



I think one solution would be to shrink the goverment. I don't think we need as many city council members as we currently have. Another solution (for us citizens) is to elect fresh new faces. I am tired of the same faces and same ideas. Support the region. Period. So what if the (hypothetical) big company doesn't locate within the city limits, but maybe the suppliers and support companies will. Maybe invest in what citizens see the most. I would be happy to see better maintained streets. My street is just terrible and the whole neighborhood has called the city but there has been no action except throwing patch work on top of patch work.

I could go on...but then again...it's all a pipe dream, this is Toledo, good ideas fall upon deaf ears.

posted by avinsurer on Aug 12, 2007 at 02:18:48 pm     #



JR: In fact, it IS called a moving van. I used one and am very happy in Madison, Wisconsin. Madison has a smaller population than Toledo, lower unemployment, less crime, fewer police... I guess Madison just lacks all the advantages that Toledo offers.

I think that when the people of Toledo elect officials that are Independents (neither GOP nor Dem.) the city will begin to change for the better.

By the way, when I tell people I'm from Toledo, a typical response still involves something about deaf people and the airport.

posted by madjack on Aug 12, 2007 at 02:57:47 pm     #



Aug 14, 2007 Blade story

The [Mayor's Commission on Disabilities] voted last Tuesday to "condemn" Mr. Finkbeiner's "illegal and inappropriate use of handicapped parking" as "an example of poor leadership" that "sets a bad example to the community."

Board President Robert Huber, who was appointed by Mr. Ford, then renewed by Mr. Finkbeiner, said in a letter that the mayor received "some well-deserved criticism" for the treatment of his dog, Scout, but the board wanted to focus attention on the illegal use of a handicapped-parking spot as well.

"We believe his conduct in this regard sets a very bad example for the rest of the community and either expressly or implicitly authorizes others to do the same," the resolution said.

posted by jr on Aug 14, 2007 at 08:19:16 am     #



Recent local stories about the idiotic actions of Toledo dems pushing out boob Ludeman.

People who make laws don't follow the laws.

I wonder if this will be tied up in court after Ludeman has been term-limited out of office in a few months? And how many taxpayer dollars will be wasted on all of this legal crapola?


A couple other stories:

The Ohio Ethics Commission has recommended against prosecuting Mayor Finkbeiner over his effort last year to supplement the income of former Toledo Public Schools Superintendent Eugene Sanders.

Aug 22, 2007 - Here's why Toledo is behind :

IF ANYONE on the 22nd floor over at One Government Center wonders why it's so tough moving Toledo forward, just review recent City Council events.

First of all, no segment of the population clamored for a change in the Toledo City Council president. The move to unseat Republican Rob Ludeman began more than two weeks ago when Mayor Finkbeiner called for Council to tone down the political rhetoric - if you can imagine that.

When issues are exaggerated among whites, nobody asks whether a white candidate supports another on the basis of race and not experience or qualification. Ms. Brown said she believed Mr. Ashford was the most experienced. Period.

Meanwhile, it's impossible to ignore that Mayor Finkbeiner didn't respond to Mr. Ashford's calls. Was that because Mr. Ashford is an A-Teamer? Because he's black? Not acceptable?

Politicians won't always see eye-to-eye. Nobody does. So have your disagreements, Council. But try to focus more on the principle of disagreements.

Neither high-tech nor low-tech industries will want to do business here when city leaders squabble about race when it shouldn't be an issue. The rest of the world recognizes the importance and value of diversity and is doing quite well as it moves right along.

However, it must have been too hot, too cold, too rainy, or too sunny in Toledo when the other communities learned that lesson and Toledo didn't.

No wonder this town is so far behind, when black and white Toledoans continue to kick and scratch about nonsense.

posted by jr on Sep 04, 2007 at 05:01:12 pm     #



Yet another reason why people in other communities laugh at Toledo. This Sep 25, 2007 Blade "news" article has to be the most idiotic news story for 2007. The story features three goofball Toledo-based politicians. Now don't get me wrong. The story is beautifully absurd and will provide comedic fodder in the future. So for that, I thank the Lucas County Clowns and the Blade.

This story and this lame ass political stunt is another example of how media and politicians perceive the public as being a bunch of morons. In their view, we can't think for ourselves. In their view, we must get all our info from the media and politicians.

Anyone with an Internet connection and the ability to do a Web search can see how this whole food stamp challenge by the county commissioners was a fraud. Yet, the local lamestream media was missing in action on providing the truth to the public. No wonder the news industry is decaying. What's the point of their existence? The local media seems to have selective new reporting practices. They only investigate what "they" think we should know.

This is embarrassing for the local media and the politicians, but they don't have the ability to understand that. And that's really funny. They don't even know people are laughing at them and considering them useless. Thanks to the Sweet LEW Daily Paper, which is still evolving, I learned more about this food challenge fraud from local, not-for-profit Web sites than I did from the local, for-profit media.

Oh, none of the Lucas County Commissioners blogged their food stamp challenge experience on their Web site. What a shock. Blogging is the easiest way to publish, but this simple, technological fact that kids understand is lost on these three politicians. They could have made daily posts, detailing their fraud, I mean, experience for public consumption and future reference. If these politicians truly believed in what they were doing, why not leave behind a personal diary on the Web of what they went through? Instead, these politicians relied solely on press conferences and the local media to "inform" the public. These people are severely behind the times.

And remember, the first rule of government is "Assume the citizenry is stupid." The second rule of government, which may not apply here, is "Pass legislation to protect the citizenry from themselves."

posted by jr on Sep 25, 2007 at 07:39:23 am     #