Toledo Talk

Cornerstone church

I have heard through the grapevine that something is going on at cornerstone, I heard but have no confirmation that one minister and one pastor have been asked to temporarily step down. Anyone know whats going on? (and no Pastor/ bishop Pitts was not one of them).

created by roygbiv on Sep 14, 2010 at 02:13:55 pm     Religion     Comments: 434

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Neighbor Saw Bishop Long with Accuser "Every Day

http://www.11alive.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=156394&catid=40

posted by watchman on Sep 30, 2010 at 06:43:17 pm     #  

to turn off bold...

posted by SensorG on Sep 30, 2010 at 06:56:51 pm     #  

the closing bold and strong didn't seem to work...

posted by SensorG on Sep 30, 2010 at 06:57:48 pm     #  

Yes, folks. It is Thursday night and Derrick Thomas is on stage with his guitar. There is a "runner" (someone feeling the spirit so strongly they have to run back and forth).

That bloody red bishop ring looks like something Barnubus Collins would wear.

You know what? He looks old.

posted by Pope_o_Toledo on Sep 30, 2010 at 08:36:35 pm     #  

Whenever someone gets busted doing something...it happens suddenly...a new level...God sends revival, miracles and signs and wonders!! Cause don't you know, God is in on the cover up also!!

What a farce.

Hey sheeple, lets show those evil non-believers...lets give twice as much money as you usually would!! Lets roll this crisis into a revival.

Ugh:(

posted by qwerty on Sep 30, 2010 at 09:04:32 pm     #  

* </bold> testing....

posted by historymike on Sep 30, 2010 at 09:14:52 pm     #  

Bye bold font...

posted by historymike on Sep 30, 2010 at 09:15:04 pm     #  

Pope_o_Toledo, how do you know what happened in church tonight? Are you watching on the internet or were you there?

posted by mztry on Sep 30, 2010 at 10:10:16 pm     #  

From another forum:

Question: What is more evil than raping your own flock for financial gain?

Answer: Inviting and paying your friends to also rape them for a week.

Now that is good shepherding there my friends.....lets see what the prophet has to say about this sort of practice....with my included commentary to bring us into relevancy today.

Isaiah 56

Come, wild animals of the field! Come, wild animals of the forest! Come and devour my people!
Come to rape my sheep anyone, especially big named flock fleecers because these sheep really are mesmerized by you and are impressed with your self proclaimed titles...

For the leaders of my people—the Lord’s watchmen, his shepherds—
are blind and ignorant.They are like silent watchdogs that give no warning when danger comes.
They love to lie around, sleeping and dreaming. Like greedy dogs, they are never satisfied.

They are ignorant shepherds,all following their own path and intent on personal gain.
You mean the sheep that get raped every week don't get partial ownership in the Church Corporation? It is all owned by the greedy shepherds? Really? So I give all this money to buy Real Estate and then I don't own the Real Estate? You mean the people that COLLECT the money are the ones this Ponzi scheme works for? Well then, I want to collect the money so it works for me too....

“Come,” they say, “let’s get some wine and have a party.Let’s all get drunk.
Then tomorrow we’ll do it again and have an even bigger party!”
Let's have a bigger conference and name it something catchy and charge people for being able to come early and charge them for watching it from their home and hypnotize them with emotional music and then entice them with false hopes and promises if they give us money. Then next year we can do it bigger and better with new sheep to rape.....and a catchy new name to go with it.....maybe we can take the numbers in the year and get creative and come up with some gimmick to make people think its the Bible.

Let judgment begin in the house of the Lord and run these moneychangers into ruins now.

posted by watchman on Oct 01, 2010 at 10:01:27 am     #  

WOW...JUST FOUND THIS RESOURCE for those who have left Cornerstone Church Toledo and Bishop Michael Pitts.

http://aboutbishopmichaelpitts.blogspot.com/

posted by watchman on Oct 01, 2010 at 10:02:28 am     #  

Watching a service online I noticed something... what kind of music minister sends texts during service? DT does, that's who!

posted by maumeegal on Oct 01, 2010 at 11:01:06 am     #  

Eddie Long is on the Cornerstone website. It sure looks like C-Stone is supporting him.
http://www.cornerstonetoledo.com/htw2010/

posted by maumeegal on Oct 01, 2010 at 11:05:07 am     #  

Bishop Eddie Long Sex Scandal - Preacher Bureau of Investigations (PBI) New Website Will Hold Preachers Accountable

The Preacher Bureau of Investigations will allow members to report out of control Pastors and make the church community aware of their behavior. The site allows members to anonymously post their comments which prevent retaliation by Pastors reported

(I-Newswire) October 1, 2010 -
New Orleans, Louisiana - A new website was launched yesterday and plans to hold preachers accountable as part of their mission statement. The Preacher Bureau of Investigations (PBI) located at www.PimpPreacher.com will allow church members to report a Pastor, Preacher, or Priest for unacceptable behavior.

With all of the recent reports of preacher sex scandals and the wealth accumulated by Prosperity Preachers, more and more church members are becoming frustrated with the state of the current church. Due to a barrage of negative publicity coming from the pulpit, many church goers are opting to avoid church all together.

Taironu Davis says, “The rich Preacher thing has gotten out of control. You now have multi millionaire preachers who accumulated all of their wealth from tithes donated to the church by faithful believers. I believe that a Mega Church should give away Mega money in the form of cash directly to needy people within the community, instead of the Pastor buying luxury cars and expensive jewelry.”

The Preacher Bureau of Investigations will allow members to report out of control Pastors and make the church community aware of their behavior. The site allows members to anonymously post their comments which prevent retaliation by Pastors reported to the site. The Pastor Bureau of Investigation is a free site that serves as an advocate for exploited church members.

If you would like to visit the site or report a Pastor that you feel is taking advantage of the congregation, please visit The Preacher Bureau of Investigation at: http://www.PimpPreacher.com

posted by qwerty on Oct 01, 2010 at 04:30:46 pm     #  

Looks like all these Charlatans will need to go get "regular jobs" like the rest of us sheep and the Apostle Paul (Tentmaker).

If any company needs sales guys look no further, these are the cream of the crop. Only thing is they only work a few hours a week.

posted by watchman on Oct 01, 2010 at 05:06:12 pm     #  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Azf-Mi-4J5I

posted by qwerty on Oct 02, 2010 at 11:33:28 am     #  

MZTRY:

You ask: Pope_o_Toledo, how do you know what happened in church tonight? Are you watching on the internet or were you there?

Didn't you see me? I'm the guy who was wearing the big phallic hat with a ring ALMOST as big as Bishop's.

posted by Pope_o_Toledo on Oct 02, 2010 at 08:48:44 pm     #  

Watchman:

re:

http://aboutbishopmichaelpitts.blogspot.com/

WOW.
and I do mean WOW.
And that is something coming from the Pope.

posted by Pope_o_Toledo on Oct 02, 2010 at 08:54:33 pm     #  

Pope_o_Toledo LOL I never knew anyone who was proud to be a dickhead! (Sorry... couldn't help myself!)

posted by mztry on Oct 03, 2010 at 12:08:35 am     #  

Jealous.

;)

posted by Pope_o_Toledo on Oct 03, 2010 at 01:22:09 am     #  

Not really! I used to be married to one! LOL

posted by mztry on Oct 03, 2010 at 11:51:18 am     #  

Pastor Bishop just announced that Eddie Long WILL NOT be coming to Cornerstone Tuedsay! About time!

posted by maumeegal on Oct 03, 2010 at 12:23:01 pm     #  

@mztry - HAH!

maumeegal - I'm not sure why any of this surprises you. Whom is Eddie Long's understudy? Bishop Pastor? Maybe Satan?

It really doesn't matter, does it? They preach about responsibility and then take zero. If you have done ANYTHING in YOUR past, they are quick to "remember when" regardless of whether they are active in sin or not. And it is always someone else's fault coupled with 1000 excuses.

We could make a cardboard cut out of some human figure, stand it up on stage and I bet people would still cut checks and be slain in the spirit. After all, we all have to only touch the hem of Bishop's garment.

posted by Pope_o_Toledo on Oct 03, 2010 at 07:04:18 pm     #  

you people need to get lives.

posted by beetlejuice on Oct 04, 2010 at 10:59:30 am     #  

Beetlejuice-and yet...here you are.

posted by qwerty on Oct 04, 2010 at 11:28:46 am     #  

http://aboutbishopmichaelpitts.blogspot.com/

posted by qwerty on Oct 04, 2010 at 11:45:01 am     #  

Beetlejuice,

Please expound.

posted by watchman on Oct 04, 2010 at 12:46:16 pm     #  

I needed a good laugh today, someone I loved very much died and I occasionally look at Toledo Talk for interesting things. I saw the large amount of comments on cornerstone church so I thought I would take a peek. To my astonishment I saw all the things being said. The only question I had while I was reading was what have you all done for God lately besides bash His children who are at least doing something? It may not meet your approval but I am sure that church is full of decent people who love God and are doing the best they can, yet with all your obvious hatred for the place yet, there you are- online watching it.

posted by beetlejuice on Oct 04, 2010 at 01:20:36 pm     #  

Don’t take it personally. Most on TT bash everything. It’s what they do. From Bishops to burritos; nothing is safe here.

Sorry about your loss.

posted by Ryan on Oct 04, 2010 at 01:42:06 pm     #  

Thank you Ryan I really appreciate that.. I normally dont do the internet blog thing but I am off work for awhile and was bored.

posted by beetlejuice on Oct 04, 2010 at 01:47:13 pm     #  

"The only question I had while I was reading was what have you all done for God lately besides bash His children who are at least doing something?"

Seriously, after reading this whole thread, that is the ONLY question you had? That says more about you than you can even begin to fathom.

Also-people who say "they never do the internet thing and are just doing it because _______ (fill in the blank)" are usually being disingenuous.

Everyone has the right to speak their mind when it comes to things they disagree with and/or don't like. It seems a number of people in the city of Toledo don't like sexual predators in sheep's clothing.

I bet if you were to think just a little harder, you could come up with some better questions.

posted by qwerty on Oct 04, 2010 at 05:20:03 pm     #  

Beetlejuice,

I echo Ryan concerning your loss.

Are you a Christian? Do you go to "Church"? Have you ever been to Cornerstone? Do you belong to Cornerstone?

If you were sitting outside your home one day sipping a cold one and you looked across the street and saw smoke coming from your neighbor's home would you continue to sip your beer or call for help and run across the street to try to rescue anyone that may be in harms way?

No one is bashing his children. The Bible (same one they use at C Stone) instructs us to EXPOSE those who contradict the truth found in scripture. To warn people when they are being exploited and taken advantage of by "Ministers".

The focus is whether the LEADERSHIP at this "Church" is a)Bibilically Sound 2) Taking advantage of people financially for their own gain

Do you think you would still attend a "Church" (let's use Eddie Long for example) that is alledgedly grooming young men for his bedroom at a later date in the name of God, because, well, at least he is DOING THE BEST HE CAN!

Hope this helps show a different perspective for you and again, my condolences regarding your recent loss.

posted by watchman on Oct 04, 2010 at 05:21:35 pm     #  

Matthew 7:15-23 "Beware of false prophets who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravaging wolves. (16) You'll recognize them by their fruit. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes or figs from thistles? (17) In the same way, every good tree produces good fruit, but a bad tree produces bad fruit. (18) A good tree can't produce bad fruit; neither can a bad tree produce good fruit. (19) Every tree that doesn't produce good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. (20) So you'll recognize them by their fruit. (21) "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord!' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of My Father in heaven. (22) On that day many will say to Me, 'Lord, Lord, didn't we prophesy in Your name, drive out demons in Your name, and do many miracles in Your name?' (23) Then I will announce to them, 'I never knew you! Depart from Me, you lawbreakers!'

posted by qwerty on Oct 04, 2010 at 06:56:08 pm     #  

2 Corinthians 11:13-15 (13) For such people are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. (14) And no wonder! For Satan himself is disguised as an angel of light. (15) So it is no great thing if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness. Their destiny will be according to their works.

2 Timothy 3:1-7 Know this also, that in the last days grievous times will be at hand. (2) For men will be self-lovers, money-lovers, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, (3) without natural affection, unyielding, false accusers, without self-control, savage, despisers of good, (4) traitors, reckless, puffed up, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, (5) having a form of godliness, but denying the power of it; even turn away from these. (6) For of these are those who creep into houses and lead captive silly women loaded with sins, led away with different kinds of lusts, (7) ever learning and never able to come to the full knowledge of the truth.

Acts 20:29-30 I know that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock. (30) And men from among yourselves will rise up with deviant doctrines to lure the disciples into following them.

posted by qwerty on Oct 04, 2010 at 07:00:30 pm     #  

"Most on TT bash everything. It’s what they do." - by Ryan, Oct 04, 2010

People are stupid! - by Ryan, Jul 15, 2007

posted by jr on Oct 04, 2010 at 08:01:21 pm     #  

"So I stopped at a gas station for my weekly 6-pack of Bud Select"

o_0

posted by upso on Oct 04, 2010 at 10:04:18 pm     #  

it's been a fun read. Can't wait for the Judgement Day/End Of The World thread...

posted by McCaskey on Oct 05, 2010 at 12:38:34 am     #  

http://www.ebiblefellowship.com/may21/index.html

On May 21st, 1988, God finished using the churches and congregations of the world. The Spirit of God left all churches and Satan, the man of sin, entered into the churches to rule at that point in time. The Bible teaches us that this awful period of judgment upon the churches would last for 23 years. A full 23 years (8400 days exactly) would be from May 21 st, 1988 until May 21st, 2011. This information was discovered in the Bible completely apart from the information regarding the 7000 years from the flood.

How long's Cornerstone and the Pitts' brothers been around?

posted by McCaskey on Oct 05, 2010 at 12:47:20 am     #  

A long time.

Where have you been hiding, McCaskey? I expected you to chime in long before this.

posted by madjack on Oct 05, 2010 at 09:07:55 am     #  

I think it is quite premature of anyone to assume that because I stated I dont normally do the blog thing that I am being disingenuous. As I stated I am off work due to a death in my family so I have more time on my hands than normal. To answer the question am I a christian? yes, I am a spirit filled, born again, tongue talking christian, have been for 30 years. I do not attend cornerstone, I have visited there on occasion and I did find it quite fascinating. I live outside toledo now but when I am in town I do go there. I dont presume to know details of any issues anyone may have had with this church or it's pastor. I simply made an observation based on the comments written by several people. There is a lot of anger and that is very sad for all involved. I guess my thoughts were aimed more toward the people that sit in this church on a weekly basis. I would like to think that people are not holding them responsible for the actions of the leadership. Based on some of the comments here, it seems some people stayed there longer than what they feel now they should have so my point I suppose, is to have compassion on those who are still there and give them the time they need to come to their conclusions as you did rather than mock, ridicule and brow beat them. They are still your brothers and sisters in Christ and they need your understanding and love more than anything..It is our love one for another that separates us from the world as you all know...And apparently they still have great love and devotion for their pastor and to ridicule him, hurts them deeply I'm sure...I know that some people in leadership make terribly incorrect even dangerous mistakes, but my thoughts are for those in this church who truly love God and are just trying to do the best they can for the God that they love. Spewing out scripture to a group of people who already know it is pointless. The devil tried that with Jesus and it got him nowhere. I guess in closing, my point is, just remember when you were there and how much it took to get you to leave, it wasnt a barage of bible versus, it was the voice of God and the tug of the Holy Spirit I assume. Give them that same opportunity and treat them as your brothers and sisters

posted by beetlejuice on Oct 05, 2010 at 09:12:30 am     #  

Woah! JR – so what that chick did wasn’t stupid? I never claimed not to bash, I just don’t circle the boards like some seem to do to do just that.

And Upso – I kicked the Bud Select habit. ;() Twas’ too pedestrian for you?

posted by Ryan on Oct 05, 2010 at 10:08:11 am     #  

Jacko--been content reading--like actual books and stuff--getting outside, enjoying the early fall weather. SB is a complete zoo scene. Actually just saw this thread on here last night for first time.

My only experience with Cornerstone was it hosted a youth church-league basketball banquet my son was part of years ago. I had never been in one of these so-called 'mega' churches. The attempted-recruiting of the parents who came was fairly heavy-handed. It was a fun time seeing the kids enjoy pictures of themselves on the large video screens, but I left thinking it was not the ind of place I'd want to spend my Sunday mornings--or any other day.

posted by McCaskey on Oct 05, 2010 at 11:03:14 am     #  

Blogs, facebook, myspace, web pages, churches, message boards, etc. are all forums for people to express their views...if any of you have not notices social media is quite the rage these days. Billions of people are on, so don't go around acting high and might like you are better than that...cause like I said...here you are. And I'm sure if you are here, you are other place on the internet (fb, myspace, etc). People can express themselves any way they see fit. If they are not preying on others for their own gain, more power to 'em.

posted by qwerty on Oct 05, 2010 at 11:47:04 am     #  

I would like to encourage all people to speak freely and to express exactly what is on their minds/in their hearts. If you want everything you say and do to be controlled, join a cult.

posted by qwerty on Oct 05, 2010 at 11:48:51 am     #  

Think we get the point. Everyone's free to go online and express opinions. It's not newsflash or sudden revelation.

posted by McCaskey on Oct 05, 2010 at 01:32:45 pm     #  

Ok, so I guess the only ones allowed to really express their opinions are the ones that agree with the angry ones so I will take my self out of this nightmare. You "christians" on this blog are waaaaay to angry and unforgiving for me...I am sure the Lord is so proud...

posted by beetlejuice on Oct 05, 2010 at 02:42:48 pm     #  

I told you juicy, rough crowd.

posted by Ryan on Oct 05, 2010 at 03:15:26 pm     #  

beetlejuice, I, too, lost eomone yesterday. I wonder if I know you???

posted by maumeegal on Oct 05, 2010 at 03:56:08 pm     #  

SO beetlejuice you suggest that people turn a blind eye to any problems in the world, especially if it concerns problems in the house of God. I suppose you are one of those people who believe that pedophile priests should not be discussed and the mere mention should be swept under the rug because the sanctity of the church is more important than the rights and well being of the victims. I guess that it is the christian thing to allow the word of God to be corrupted and abused, instead of calling it out for what it is. And I guess it better to allow a false prophet to teach than to be unchristian and warn others. And I guess it is the christian thing to to forgive sins when forgiveness has neither been requested, or repentance offered.

If this is your view of Christianity it is no wonder that people are leaving churches in droves. I once had a discussion with a group of people of mixed faith and beliefs from very conservative Christians, Catholic's, non denominational Christians, Baptist, Seeker Christians, and even a couple Agnostics and atheists, and one of the Conservative Christians was arguing that it was the higher education system in the US that was causing people to leave the churches by teaching atheism. The Atheists and the Agnostics both argued that it was the hypocrisy that they saw with-in churches especially “Christian” churches that had originally pushed them away from first the church, and then God.

posted by roygbiv on Oct 05, 2010 at 03:56:39 pm     #  

Monday night Heaven on Earth = $100 early access passes all gone, Sheryl Brady gay bashes and tells congregation to get sober, buy a Heal the World T-Shirt for $20, give a $50 seed offering and have some barbeque on your way out. Come back tomorrow, Eddie Long has been replaced. Salvation... priceless.

posted by maumeegal on Oct 05, 2010 at 04:05:38 pm     #  

Everyone know's Sheryl Brady is two cans short of a six pack. They should sell alcohol and condoms.

posted by qwerty on Oct 05, 2010 at 05:19:02 pm     #  

1. People high in authority, adultery is not new, it's just with divorce now coming up, the church had to make a "stand" and make 2 sit for 2 weeks, in the future they can say there did something way back when. I know the one has a child with someone else in the church... it's kept hush hush inside the church.

2. If you give cash, it usually doesn't make it to where it was suppose to go, but it does end up in someone's pocket.

3. Those that have left and been booted have questioned something that was happening at the church at the time. Some were removed faster than others. All were going to be removed anyway.

4. Members don't talk to all former members, you know what I mean depending on how deep you are in the church. Some have been shunned. There are some that will see me and not know who I am when in fact we came together and had a few lunches and spend hours together while both attending the church.

5. Ministries inside the church are about making others feel comfortable, not those doing the volunteering, they are expected to do a job. If you get too deep and want to stop, in some cases you are asked to leave the church.

6. Should church leaders be shown when they break, the law, have DUI's? Why not, they are a non-profit business. They owe the public.

If you have went to the church, gotten involved for a period of time, you know what I am talking about in this message. Current members can close their eyes, but it still doesn't stop what is going on. When you step out, your eyes will open wide and you shall see the truth.

People were sent away for things the staff get away with.

posted by KZee on Oct 05, 2010 at 08:16:48 pm     #  

where is this blog that everyone at Cornerstone is talking about? On Sunday I watched on-line and Bishop told us to stay away from all the blogs and putting stuff out there on the internet. I really want answers, but I don't know what or who to believe anymore?? there are a lot of rumors going around, but maybe there isn't any truth to them. I know the devil really wants to attack the church and keep us from fulfilling Bishop's calling. If someone can answer me straight, how do I know if it is God who is showing me stuff or an evil spirit set out to hold us back from the level that has been prophesied. I'm an intelligent person, so please don't insult me..thanks.

posted by RyanR on Oct 05, 2010 at 09:21:55 pm     #  

Ryan,

I want you to know that all the time I spent on this forum posting the truths that I did was for people like you. Thank God for Him beginning to open your eyes to the truth.

You can get answers here or at the blog someone has set up re those who left or are leaving C Stone for one reason or another.

God did not put you on this earth to fulfill another man's calling. You have your own gifts and calling that are just as important. That is one of the crafty ways that people are controlled in these types of Churches today.

You also are anointed the same as Michael. We are all kings and priests. There is no laity and clergy distinction as much as they want you to believe that so you can again be controlled.

There is no "level" to attain to anywhere. Jesus Blessed all of us through his act of atonement. No new levels, anointings, realms, areas, nothing.

The only thing that is "new" to you is what God is opening your eyes to in this season.

May God continue to open your eyes.....may you see all that you are IN HIM and all that you can never be in following a man.

posted by watchman on Oct 05, 2010 at 10:41:18 pm     #  

We ARE all priests and kings! Some of us are even Popes!

We are also ALL God's children.

I'm sorry to hear Sheryl Brady was anti Homo. The wagons are a circling.

Was it implied on this board that her knees were in two different zip codes? The woman is a complete fruit cake. That is all I know.

I have spoken.

posted by Pope_o_Toledo on Oct 05, 2010 at 11:00:49 pm     #  

So beetlejuice, are you really user godskid?

You triggered the sockpuppet alarm today. Can you explain?

posted by jr on Oct 05, 2010 at 11:01:30 pm     #  

maumeegal, are you also user mztry?

posted by jr on Oct 05, 2010 at 11:28:52 pm     #  

uh
oh

posted by upso on Oct 05, 2010 at 11:54:45 pm     #  

jr... Are you a cheeseburger?

posted by maumeegal on Oct 06, 2010 at 12:19:59 am     #  

I left C-Stone years ago because no one is allowed to use their spiritual gifts, speak out or ask questions. I am not a Stepford Christian.

posted by maumeegal on Oct 06, 2010 at 12:22:14 am     #  

Don't be ridiculous. JR was never a cheeseburger - he was a hedge trimmer. But that was years ago.

If Beetlejuice is GodSkid and maumeegal is mztry, does that mean Ryan is a large rubber dildo?

posted by madjack on Oct 06, 2010 at 12:57:09 am     #  

"jr... Are you a cheeseburger?"

OK. Well, I'll defer to smarter IT people because I may be overlooking a simple technical detail, such as two people sharing the same Web-enabled gadget or network.

Can someone explain why every comment posted in this thread by mztry and maumeegal contains the same IP address, and that IP address only appears in one other post in the new version of Toledo Talk, and it's a thread started by mztry?

What's the possible explanation for these two comments having the same IP address? The comments appear one after the other in this thread, about 19 minutes apart.

posted by maumeegal on Sep 29, 2010 at 10:58:01 pm #

posted by mztry on Sep 29, 2010 at 11:17:00 pm #


And it happened again in this thread, about 15 minutes apart. Same IP address for both comments.

posted by maumeegal on Sep 30, 2010 at 02:34:09 am #

posted by mztry on Sep 30, 2010 at 02:49:28 am #

posted by jr on Oct 06, 2010 at 12:59:59 am     #  

:P Owned.

I love this post. I read it at least every other day. can barely keep up with the ramblings, jabs, & profound theological discussions...

posted by jdmsbyrd on Oct 06, 2010 at 02:10:50 am     #  

"If Beetlejuice is GodSkid and maumeegal is mztry, does that mean Ryan is a large rubber dildo?"

I love the turn this thread has taken!

posted by Pope_o_Toledo on Oct 06, 2010 at 07:00:09 am     #  

I also read it every day. I have a lot of concern for some of the people posting here. Hunger for spiritual guidance seems to render them blind to manipulation. I never understood how Jim Jones could manipulate his followers into taking the action they did. This thread has given me a window into how that can happen. It begins when followers deny clear evidence of wrong doing on the part of their "spritual" ( insert bishop ) leader or explain it away through the circuitous use of scripture. Sad, because instead of the reassuring peace that's supposed to come from faith they instead become defensive, and if placed higher in the church heriarchy, secretive.

posted by holland on Oct 06, 2010 at 08:31:44 am     #  

Holland the most powerful tool that people like Jim Jones, or money worshipers have in churches today, is that they are able to convience people (and people are eger to give up control) that Faith and believing are more important than understanding, and in fact teach that understanding cannot be achieved because the spiritual (all things relating to God) are outside of our ability to understand. Add to this the fact that most people are just looking for magic pills that will make them happy and wealthy and better looking, without having to do any of the work, and they make easy pickings. Believe what I teach you, and all your prayers will come true, not only here but in the after life. You want treasures believe what I teach you and I'll show you how God will give you treasure here on earth and in heaven, the only catch is you have to believe without question, if you question how things are done, it just shows you don't have faith, and you will not have treasure either here or in heaven.

posted by roygbiv on Oct 06, 2010 at 08:51:26 am     #  

We have now entered CSI : Toledo Talk. Love it.
I thought watching mass for shut-ins was my smart way of Sunday services. Can't believe everything I am missing at the C-Stone.

posted by Hoops on Oct 06, 2010 at 09:01:19 am     #  

When I left Cornerstone Church years ago along with several other leaders at the time, the first thing I had to do is be honest with myself if I was ever going to make the transition out of this sort of controlling environment.

You see a lot of people place the blame on Michael or Cornerstone, but I had to look at it differently and ask myself this question...

What is it in me that ATTRACTED me to this sort of set up versus just attending the regular old baptist congregation down the street?

Over time I found the answers and was able to purge those things from my life to avoid repeating the same "extremist" pattern somewhere else in my life...

At the end of the day, no one forced you to visit Cornerstone and then join and then open up your wallet to finance lavish leadership lifestyles in the "name of Gawd".

I encourage people to take this approach as much as they may be slandered and spoken evil of upon their departure. These guys spare no expense in making sure that there is not one ounce of love shown toward those who may want to actually "release themselves" to go do what they feel God wants them to do with their lives.

And they have to do this because they will never be released under this set up, only controlled. The insecurity of the leader runs too deep to risk others getting the praise....

Hope that makes some sense..

posted by watchman on Oct 06, 2010 at 09:04:28 am     #  

Rainbow, I agree with you. Our society in general has been mesmerized by the quick fix with little or no effort.

Drop a dime in the bucket and get 10 dimes from God is nothing more than gambling. Mine as well go to Vegas and get free drinks if your going to do that...

No one wants to read the Bible. They want someone else to do it for them and tell them all the formulas to get a bigger house, a new car, and you name it...

Its easier that way for awhile, until the disillusionment and reality hits years later that ALL THE PROPHECIES and PROMISES from the men of Gawd, never ever come to pass.

That is when people start to realize that a lot of this is puff the magic dragon BS and leave these set ups.

posted by watchman on Oct 06, 2010 at 09:11:16 am     #  

Think again, cheeseburger! LOL Think coffee! I'm on my way to church!

posted by mztry on Oct 06, 2010 at 09:12:48 am     #  

Don't believe it? Go pull out the last ten years of preacher "prophecies" and be honest with yourself...did that ever happen? no. Be honest, don't lie to yourself.

posted by watchman on Oct 06, 2010 at 09:14:26 am     #  

Can someone explain why every comment posted in this thread by mztry and maumeegal contains the same IP address

I suppose it's possible the two are living in the same house and sharing a computer. That said, Ockham's razor ( lex parsimoniae or law of parsimony) dictates that the two are on, shall we say, better than expected speaking terms with each other.

I'd delete the accounts and leave it at that.

posted by madjack on Oct 06, 2010 at 10:13:18 am     #  

mztry/maumeegal, did you lose track of which account said what?

jr... Are you a cheeseburger?
posted by maumeegal on Oct 06, 2010 at 12:19:59 am #

Think again, cheeseburger!
posted by mztry on Oct 06, 2010 at 09:12:48 am #


holland said: "I have a lot of concern for some of the people posting here."

Don't be concerned.

More than half the comments posted in this thread were created by only a handful of users, and they are all user accounts that were created after this thread began except for one user. And these users have posted all their Toledo Talk comments in just this thread, except for user godskid, which existed prior to the Cornerstone thread and posted one comment in another church-related thread.

This thread started on Sep 14, 2010.
As of now, 404 comments have been posted.

                           Comments Posted
+-------------------+--------------+-------------+--------------+
| username          |  Toledo Talk | This Thread | Member Since | 
+-------------------+--------------+-------------+--------------+
| godskid           |       58     |      57     | Aug 02, 2010 |
| watchman          |       66     |      66     | Sep 14, 2010 |
| Pope_o_Toledo     |       38     |      38     | Sep 15, 2010 |
| freefromthestone  |       14     |      14     | Sep 22, 2010 |
| qwerty            |       22     |      22     | Sep 23, 2010 |
| maumeegal         |       11     |      11     | Sep 27, 2010 |
| beetlejuice       |        5     |       5     | Sep 29, 2010 |
+-------------------+--------------+-------------+--------------+
                           214           213

I'm not interested in this type of new-user posting behavior. Plus, sockpuppets likely exist here. This thread should have been kiboshed long ago.

This site began in January 2003, and this thread set the record for the most comments. The Toledo Talk board of directors are displeased. The previous record was 324 comments in the Nov 7, 2006 thread titled Election day open thread.

Politics and religion.

Simple solution for the schlubs listed above: create a free blog at Wordpress.com or create a message board at VanillaForums.com and discuss your Cornerstone issues there. Inform me about your site, and I'll mention it here so the fans with a morbid curiosity can stop by.

In case someone whines: about --> posting guidelines --> Free Speech --> ToledoTalk.com is NOT a free speech zone.

For those of you interested in this thread, remember this URL: http://toledotalk.com/r

Word is the Admin cometh with fire shooting out of his fingers.

And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. - Revelation 6:8

posted by jr on Oct 06, 2010 at 10:13:48 am     #  

No one wants to read the Bible.

Can you blame them? Go into any public school classroom, eighth grade or higher and hand everyone a King James version of the Holy Bible. Tell the class to read any chapter in the four gospels of their choice and explain it. I'll bet you any amount you care to name that you get one or two percent at best that can actually read it and come close to 50% comprehension. This is just the kids eighth grade and higher I'm talking about, which is one audience you're trying to reach. Try the same thing with adults 25 and older and you'll be amazed at the results you get.

The only people who are going to come close to passing an exam like this have an extremely high rate of comprehension and a vocabulary to match, or have been through Sunday school and had it explained to them by a better than average theologian, one who understands the original Hebrew, Greek and Latin. Including the verb tenses peculiar to those languages which are not represented in English.

Worse, King James is the only version the Gideon society will hand out, which means that they are passing out truckloads of material that most people cannot understand. Good job, folks.

posted by madjack on Oct 06, 2010 at 10:26:05 am     #  

Another thing I've never seen in Church services is the minister asking the congregation if they understood the sermon. A very few ministers will entertain questions from the congregation after the sermon; fewer will allow questions while the congregates are still seated in the sanctuary. Why do you suppose that is? Lack of knowledge? What?

Have a typical minister on any given Sunday ask the entire congregation to take out paper and pencil and write down the three items most memorable in his sermon. Let him read the answers and I'll bet his eyes will be opened. He'll gain some new insight into the efficacy of his sermons - likely something he doesn't want to hear.

Meantime, no one wants to read the Bible.

posted by madjack on Oct 06, 2010 at 10:33:13 am     #  

So Jr are you killing this thread because it has generated too much discussion, even if half of it has been by a small group of new people. I understand its your site and you can do with it as you please, but it seems counter productive. You seem disturbed that its the longest thread and its about religion, would you rather have it be about mexican restaurants, or a smoking ban in California, at leat the cornerstone/ religion angle is relevant to Toledoans. Even the Eddie Long diversion was relevant in that he was coming to Toledo, and does have connections with Cornerstone.

posted by roygbiv on Oct 06, 2010 at 10:35:09 am     #  

If TT is not a free speech zone, then What is IT?

Good User Stats, but don't need all of the Board of Directors, I have spoken, I don't like this new user behavior blah blah blah....

Its fine, you can but are you being sarcastic. If not, we should all be scared as to when you will use stats and snippets of threads for all of us.

posted by jdmsbyrd on Oct 06, 2010 at 11:12:39 am     #  

"I understand its your site and you can do with it as you please ..."

roygbiv, that's the only thing you got correct in your comment.

Over half of the comments in this thread have been created by a small group of new user accounts. In my view, that's a whole lot different than if all those comments were created by "old" Toledo Talk users.

Posting guidelines --> Equal Rights --> ToledoTalk.com is NOT an equal rights zone. --> "I'll admit to a favorable bias toward [old], active contributors."

roygbiv, re-read my previous comment and understand that the issue is with people posting under multiple accounts, and new users posting dozens of comments in only one thread. The thread's subject matter is irrelevant to what I'm talking about.

What, these new users have been reading Toledo Talk for months or years, and now they decided to create an account because of the Cornerstone topic? Unlikely. I'm guessing they recently found this site for the first time somehow because of the Cornerstone topic, and their only purpose for being here is to post in this one thread.

If you approve of that type of posting behavior, then start your own message board and manage it however you want. One-thread wonders don't interest me. They don't help make a good community site, in my opinion. Look, a zillion different ways exist to manage a message board. This is mine.

I believe most humans have many interests. Since this Cornerstone thread began on Sep 14, over 90 threads have been started here, and none of these new users have posted in another thread. Come on.

"Old" Toledo Talk users can continue to discuss this thread.

posted by jr on Oct 06, 2010 at 11:28:14 am     #  

jr, you make me shake my head.

You've made it clear on here on numerous instances you're king of the jungle. I get it, Mufasa. It's your board.

'I believe most humans have many interests. Since this Cornerstone thread began on Sep 14, over 90 threads have been started here, and none of these new users have posted in another thread. Come on.'

So, if over 90 other threads were started here since this one began, what's the problem? How is this thread having such an adverse/overly-dominating effect on the site?

I get the sock-puppet enforcement. But if a bunch of 'new posters' who have an interest in this Cornerstone deal keep coming back here to comment, so what?

You've always been a 'free choice' guy, right? If any TT posters--'old' or 'new'--get sick of this thread, they can stop reading/participating in it any time and move on.

I half-heartedly made reference on here to the 'end of times' debate/discussion/ sure to come before next May but my guess is you'll get some individuals--'new posters'--coming aboard for that too--is that getting snipped off as well after it gets too long with too many 'new' participants?

posted by McCaskey on Oct 06, 2010 at 12:09:46 pm     #  

I'm surprised this thread was allowed to continue as long as it has. It likely wouldn't ever be a topic that would exhaust it's self, especially given the proclivity of certain church leaders to engage in activites that invite attention. Sooner or later something truely, legally defamatory would get posted and jr could find himself imbroiled in a legal morass, even though he would not be legally responsible. Why go there? I have no problem seeing this thread get dumped.

posted by holland on Oct 06, 2010 at 01:15:37 pm     #  

"You've made it clear on here on numerous instances you're king of the jungle."

Not just me.

photodan said in April 2005:

"jr has every right to make this site as closed or even as censored as he wants it to be. If he decided that the word, "it" was not allowed to be posted then that is his right. This is not free speech. We are only allowed to post here at jr's whim since he's the one paying for it. He owns the space we are scrawling upon."

psyche777 said in June 2005:

"There is no such thing as free speech on message boards -- they are controlled by those who own them. So unless you own your own? pretty much have to play by whatever rules exist."


"But if a bunch of 'new posters' who have an interest in this Cornerstone deal keep coming back here to comment, so what?"

As I said above: "One-thread wonders don't interest me. They don't help make a good community site, in my opinion."

And I don't consider it a "bunch" of new users. It's only a few new accounts because some are sockpuppets.

I am unable to compute mentally why only a few new user accounts have such a tremendous interest in only one thread. To me, it's odd, and that leads to suspicion.

"You've always been a 'free choice' guy, right?"

Yes, and as I said above: "Look, a zillion different ways exist to manage a message board. This is mine."

I chose to manage the board this way. The political threads here are quarantined into their own forum, separate from the front page. That's another choice.

For the last 18 months or so, I've made it somewhat difficult for new users to create accounts and post comments and threads here. That's another choice. Why? To slow down the spammers, trolls, flamers, and sockpuppets. Over that same period, I've been quick to deactivate some new user accounts for behavior I did not approve of. That's another choice. On another board, they would be allowed to continue. That's the choice of that board owner.

And the end-times next year or whenever will resolve any message board issues on its own. So I'm not worried.

McCaskey, you said yesterday: "SB is a complete zoo scene."

Why is that?

posted by jr on Oct 06, 2010 at 01:22:21 pm     #  

Taco whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?

posted by Ryan on Oct 06, 2010 at 01:52:06 pm     #  

IMO SB is zoo scene because it's dominated by screeching political wackos ...ON NEARLY EVERY THREAD. That site exists for seemingly one purpose--politcal foodfights.

That's not the case on here. Here there are many diverse threads, on many topics. This just happens to be one of them and anyone who tires of this thread can skip over it and go on to something completely different.

Holland brings up an interesting take--the defamatory/legal aspect. That one I get and in fact wondered about while reading some of the comments.

posted by McCaskey on Oct 06, 2010 at 01:53:22 pm     #  

Here there are many diverse threads, on many topics.

And we can have food fights and flame wars on all of 'em! We don't need to restrict ourselves to one subject - plain old boring politics.

Seriously, I think JR's point is that since he owns the show, he can cancel at any time for no other reason than he woke up on the wrong side of the gutter this morning. Such is the price end users pay for accepting someone else's generosity - the provider can stop the service whenever they like.

For instance, there was a service some years back called TightCircle, a sort of invitation only social network. You paid an annual fee and were provided with a BBS type space for message exchange. One fine day someone bought the software and the place closed down amidst a flurry of refunds. And that was that.

posted by madjack on Oct 06, 2010 at 04:04:15 pm     #  

I fully acknowledged that Jr can close this thread and even erase it if he so desires, this thread never reached who it was intended for anyhow.

posted by roygbiv on Oct 06, 2010 at 04:13:00 pm     #  

"... this thread never reached who it was intended for anyhow."

How can that be after three weeks and 400 comments?? And you wonder why I'm grumbling.

This thread will not be closed, it will not be removed from the front page, and it will not be erased, so you can continue with your discussion.

posted by jr on Oct 06, 2010 at 04:55:50 pm     #  

Jr. Just because I posted a question here, does not mean that it was actually intended for someone(s) already on this board It was directed and intended for a few select people whom I had hoped would stumble upon it much like those new people. However those it was intended for either did not find it, or found it and opted not to communicate at this time, (although I did enjoy the comments by watchman (who I have seen Post in other places with similar comments but still worth reading) and Popeoftoledo, and even godskid were worth debating with. So even though there were 400 comments I was actually only looking for a couple, and they never showed up. And thanks for not erasing it all, who knows it may still be found, and I'm sure the novality will wear off as arguments recycle.

posted by roygbiv on Oct 06, 2010 at 06:38:01 pm     #  

It garnered enough attention to warrant a mention from Michael. He warned us not to read them or believe what is being said there/here. I suppose some people just decide to go thier own way anyway.

posted by fred on Oct 06, 2010 at 08:09:28 pm     #  

I'll admit that I had trouble understanding this thread. It seemed unwieldy. Kudos to those with the patience to read each comment.

I got annoyed by too many comments that contained large blobs of text with no paragraph breaks. Then I noticed other users writing in a similar style. That led to some searching, which led to more searching. Then I found some questionable user behavior, which irritated me, and that led to sweeping account deactivations.

I was content to let this thread fizzle out until fred's comment above.

"It garnered enough attention to warrant a mention from Michael. He warned us not to read them or believe what is being said there/here."

To fred, or anyone else, what has been posted in this thread about Cornerstone Church that is false? Obviously, the answer to that question depends upon who is asked.

Why would a preacher take time out of a service to "warn" the congregation to ignore certain Web sites? The answer is probably contained in some of the comments above, right?

Anyway, I may re-enable all those new user accounts, and follow McCaskey's viewpoint and let you all decide for yourselves whether to read or not read the comments.

posted by jr on Oct 07, 2010 at 02:04:15 pm     #  

thanks jr...good call about fred & michael...says a lot about the "power" of TT- saving dogs, recommending restaurants, causing lapses of faith...

posted by jdmsbyrd on Oct 07, 2010 at 07:06:27 pm     #  


Is this appropriate for this discussion?(or whatever it is) Makes me chuckle.

posted by hunkytownsausage on Oct 07, 2010 at 08:53:29 pm     #  

New user RyanR said on Oct 5:

where is this blog that everyone at Cornerstone is talking about? On Sunday I watched on-line and Bishop told us to stay away from all the blogs and putting stuff out there on the internet.

A preacher is ordering his followers not to read and write on the Web. Interesting.

More than one user above posted the link to this blog:
http://aboutbishopmichaelpitts.blogspot.com

As to the new user accounts related to this thread, all is as it was before. Meaning those accounts have been re-enabled, so users can login. New user sign-ups have also been re-enabled.

If you think the size of this thread makes it too slow to load, then someone can start a new Cornerstone Church thread.

The hell with it. Let it be a free-for-all.

posted by jr on Oct 07, 2010 at 09:24:50 pm     #  

The "About Bishop Michael Pitts" blog address has changed. The new location is:
lifeaftercornerstonetoledo.blogspot.com

posted by MrsPhoenix on Oct 07, 2010 at 09:39:39 pm     #  

I have returned.

Now... we wait.

posted by Pope_o_Toledo on Oct 08, 2010 at 06:37:59 am     #  

The heretical teachings at the Heaven On Earth conference where blatant. I find it amazing that when it comes to "sin" and living like a heathen, the grace of God and Jesus death is sufficient, but when it comes to giving the pimps money/offerings we need new levels, new anointings, more prayer, more blah blah blah...the veil is growing thinner? The veil was rent from top to bottom, the veil covering the scheming "men of gawwd" is the only thing growing thinner. I think that is what God is really trying to tell this people, but they are so lost and blind to their own way that they twist everything God is saying/doing to benefit their bank accounts.

The veil is growing thinner take heed, its almost transparent now. A little more time and all will be exposed.

posted by qwerty on Oct 11, 2010 at 07:02:35 pm     #  

New blog RE: Corner the Stone
http://cornerthestonetoledo.blogspot.com/

posted by maumeegal on Feb 06, 2011 at 11:45:12 pm     #  

OK. Its been quite awhile. A long period of silence since qwerty posted "A little more time and all will be exposed." Anybody heard anything new? Is the church still packin 'em in? Do they still have that ATM in the lobby for tithing?

posted by holland on Sep 13, 2012 at 09:28:02 pm     #   1 person liked this

posted by anonymouscoward on Sep 14, 2012 at 07:40:22 am     #  

</h1></h2></h3></h4></h5></h6></font></font>trying to close the bold crap

posted by anonymouscoward on Sep 14, 2012 at 07:41:34 am     #  

testing

posted by upso on Sep 14, 2012 at 08:52:37 am     #  

If the bolding is still enabled and annoying, try this thread:

Cornerstone Church thread part 2

posted by jr on Sep 14, 2012 at 09:48:43 am     #  

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