Toledo Talk


created by wolfman on Jun 27, 2011 at 03:36:53 am     Politics     Comments: 18

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So apparently this guy is jealous that he can't get his ideas as much coverage as the Koch brothers? Does he realize that there are fewer people now paying into SS while more and more people are receiving SS?
I love the fact that he doesn't give one fact to dispute anything, just says that it is all lies.

posted by fred on Jun 27, 2011 at 09:33:00 am     #  

Hey!!!! I just noticed, the bastard didn't even mention WSPD or my show. SOB

posted by fred on Jun 27, 2011 at 09:33:36 am     #  

All of his answers are "Getting that loot for those evil rich bastards"....

While the tax code absolutely needs reworked to be fair to ALL AMERICANS (talking to you 40% who pay no taxes), just giving Washington more money to shit down the crapper by taxing the rich without real changes has lead us to where we are now.

posted by dbw8906 on Jun 27, 2011 at 12:38:06 pm     #  

40% pay no taxes? Not quite...

According to the Urban-Brookings Tax Policy Center, it is true that 38 percent of "tax units" ó which can be singles, couples, or families ó are projected to have zero or negative income tax liability in 2009. About 60 percent of these households make $20,000 per year or less.

However, being exempt from income tax does not mean youíre exempt from federal taxes. Everyone who works is liable for payroll taxes, contributions to Medicare and Social Security that come out of every paycheck. There are also excise taxes on some goods and services, most notably the 18.4 cents per gallon tax on gasoline. The Congressional Budget Office found that earners in the lowest quintile, where most of those with no income tax liability fall, shouldered 4.3 percent of the payroll tax burden in 2005 and 11.1 percent of the excise taxes. Their effective tax rate (which is calculated by dividing taxes paid by total income) in those categories, according to the CBO, was in fact significantly higher than the rate of the top quintile, although that top one-fifth of the population had a much higher effective tax rate for individual and corporate income taxes.

Of course 40% of people "pay no taxes", that's better than the 66% of companies that "pay no taxes"...

posted by SensorG on Jun 27, 2011 at 02:30:31 pm     #   1 person liked this

Thank you SensorG! I think the bottom 47% don't pay federal taxes. Reasons why can be laid to the right wings attacks on working people over the last thirty years. Outsourcing middle-class manufacturing to slave economies then wanting Americans to compete by cutting wages, benefits, and social programs. They brought the private sector pay scale down to poverty wages that now cannot pay the taxes to support our country. Guess what the top will be paying more.

posted by wolfman on Jun 27, 2011 at 03:07:02 pm     #   1 person liked this

MrG - Your 110% correct that corporate welfare is no better than social welfare, they are both failing at historic levels.

"Outsourcing middle-class manufacturing to slave economies then wanting Americans to compete by cutting wages, benefits, and social programs." - Here is the problem with your argument, the companies who you tell us are going to save all of us in this region, the UAW was the first manufacturing group to dry hump the life outta NAFTA and your beloved Chrysler reveled in cheap Mexican labor (and still do) while GM hoped the first rickshaw to China. Your beloved saviors are 99.9% of the problem.

Once companies noticed the Big 3 doing it without any large scale public backlash they all followed suit for the first plane to anywhere that they could get workers for peanuts.

If the shit really hit the fan here and the economy collapsed, you think GM and Chrysler are closing plants around the world and moving production back here to "save the country"?

So clap like a seal for your beloved unions, as with the one hand you shake the other plays you like a fool. The UAW is not out to save the good ole USA.

posted by dbw8906 on Jun 27, 2011 at 05:36:18 pm     #  

dbw8906 the UAW was not the first! Really I wonder where you guys get your make believe ideas. We first lost textiles then electronics, then steel all along the American public cheered because Reagan was blowing a hole in our deficits by spending two trillion in borrowed money to fund his silly ideas. Yes any fool can spend money but now comes the hard part to cut spending when 47% of the American public can't afford the government we have because of on going war on the Middle class.

As for Fred and his silly little show come on really? Your show is nothing more than cheap entertainment because all the other options in Toledo are so poor. No one cares about your causes, Hell you can't ever generate a hundred hits on your website...give us all a break Fred please!

posted by wolfman on Jun 27, 2011 at 11:06:41 pm     #   1 person liked this

The problem with textiles wasnít closing of American shops moving overseas, it was cheap labor opening shop in other countries and then selling to American companies to sell to Americans. You think we exported electronics for low cost labor? Yeah cause names like Sony, Toshiba, Seiko, Hitachi, & Sanyo all sound like companies that started in Ohio or Michigan right? Let me guess in 1978 Fujitsu closed up shop in Peoria and moved operations to Japan right? We got beat at our own game on electronics by competitors, what should we bomb Japan and Korea so we can build TVís here again? Ohh maybe we can drop plague ridden blankets off in Indonesia so they wonít make Nikes anymore. I promise you are not reading this on a PC that was made in America, you dirty traitor.

If Union Labor is the backbone of the American worker than where was it while everything was going south? Where were the million man marches on Washington, why didnít you picket your union shops and shut production lines down, if you have so much power why didnít you do something? Oh thatís right because in the 70ís, 80ís, & 90ís when UAW workers where still making 25 bucks an hour to screw a bolt on a wheel they didnít give a damn about anyone else. You rode your jet skis at your lake house while Chrysler used (and still do) slave labor in Mexico, you chuckled about your 25 dollars a month family health coverage while the rest of us fought rate increases. You did NOTHING for the other 85% of the work force the last 30 years, but now that the chips are down you want to rally Americans to your camp cause you need our support (tax dollars) to keep your games going. Sorry after levy, after levy, and fee after fee from Uncle Sam, Americans are tapped out.

Lol "War on the middle class", letís hope it's a failure like The War on Drugs, War on Illiteracy, War on Obesity, War on War.... Over the last 50 or 60 years we have not been real good with wars. How about stop idolizing this sacred cow called "The Middle Class" it doesn't exist, it never did. It was just people going to work, paying the bills, and raising families who didnít own a Porsche. Stop trying to lump people into a box and then create policies for them depending on their box (sex, skin color, bank accounts), create programs that are good for ALL AMERICANS. Most Americans are not adverse to paying taxes, but we are tired of dumping our money into bottomless pits in C-Bus and Washington. Enough wars, enough failed social spending, enough giving our money away to competitor countries in the name of global warming, just ENOUGH. Fix our schools, fix our cities, fix our roads, itís really not rocket science. But our leaders are more concerned with Libya and the temperature of ocean water than the temperature of the people they represent. Stop creating enemies (rich people, conservatives, Glen Beck) because they all are entitled to their opinion and vote, Paul I think you would round up anyone who listens to WSPD and ship them off to a mind correction camp. Your no better than the men you hate, youíre a pint sized Rush Limbaugh spouting off propaganda with no real factual basis outside of a UAW handbook. Rich people are not the problem, gaggles of them who stopped listening to the American people are. Guess what they wear R's & D's and quite a few of them are just about as rich as the Kotch brothers. Ask John Kerry about skipping out on millions of dollars in yacht taxes when the people of his State desperately need the money. I donít hate anyone for the amount of money they have or have not made, I donít hate anyone for the car they have in their driveway.

posted by dbw8906 on Jun 28, 2011 at 09:17:47 am     #  

Wolfman blah blah blah, then... "all along the American public cheered because Reagan was blowing a hole in our deficits by spending two trillion in borrowed money to fund his silly ideas. Yes any fool can spend money but now comes the hard part to cut spending when 47% of the American public can't afford the government we have because of on going war on the Middle class."

Yeah...a President out of office for 22 years is the problem. Right. Not the current President's incredibly wasteful shameful spree, heaven's no Although, according to your logic above, there is no bigger fool than Obama since he is projected to add the most money to our national debt in history.

Your no better than the men you hate, youíre a pint sized Rush Limbaugh spouting off propaganda with no real factual basis outside of a UAW handbook.


posted by oldhometown on Jun 28, 2011 at 01:07:41 pm     #  

Wolfman I apologize, for the Rush Limbaugh remark. It was mean spirited and did not contribute to the topic. You have the right to express your opinion like everyone else.

Here is the crappy part, you care about our country and you often make some good points. But everything you reference comes from the UAW, Code Pink, or some super zany left wing group. Not everything that doesn't agree with Obama is the enemy. Stop making people who don't agree with you into The Great Satan. You can't garner our support when you put us down with every breath.

Your 110% right as wars are bankrupting this country, but the People of American not the Unions are going to have to be the one to fix it. Do you not see the hypocritical stance of clinging to them as our saviors while they work the system like everyone else?

posted by dbw8906 on Jun 28, 2011 at 01:18:27 pm     #  

I take the opposing view here to illustrated the moronic ideas that are being floated by well funded groups that are doing much harm to our country. dbw8906 we agree that 750 billion spent a year on do nothing wars is killing the country. We should be spending that money here at home not defending other countries who spend nearly nothing on their own defense. Unions have their part in creating the Middle class since they have become bloated and bureaucratic they have lost the will to do the good work they have historically done in the past. With the loss of union membership so goes the clout which has brought about the demise of middle class jobs.

posted by wolfman on Jun 29, 2011 at 03:02:42 am     #  

but the People of American not the Unions are going to have to be the one to fix it

And how will those people be organized, I'm wondering, since unions' power is being whittled away with a chainsaw?

posted by Anniecski on Jun 29, 2011 at 09:33:00 am     #  

Annie as follow up to you Wolfman question, if you had all this power, what did you do with it? Why didn't Unions draw a line in the sand while they had a chance? Where where you fighting for the American worker? As union shops closed around this country and the work went elsewhere, where where the mass protest sticking up for your union "brother". It wouldn't have anything to do with still being fat, happy, and giggling for the last 20 years while the other 85% of us struggled? When we asked for help the only answer was "well you should have unionized"? Unions abandoned the rest of the workforce, but now you need us to save you. And now that you want more of my tax dollars my answer is "well should have minded the shop when you had the chance".

Annie and Wolfie I can stand next to any American who wants a better future, who wants change, who knows there is a better way (even if we all don't agree on 100% of the issues). I'm sure I was the only person who had voted Republican who protested in 2005 against the Iraq war, I sure as shit didn't tell the other protesters that cause they might have shot me. I don't have to work with you or get paid more/less than you to want a better future. The definition of Liberty is not stamped on the back of a union card.

posted by dbw8906 on Jun 29, 2011 at 01:05:29 pm     #

The first is FDR who opposed public sector unions and the second is George Meany founder of the AFL CIO who also was opposed to public sector unions. Yet these are people democrats cite as shining examples for their party. Too bad no one listened to them back then.

posted by Linecrosser on Jun 29, 2011 at 08:33:49 pm     #  

oops he wasn't the founder just he president of the AFL for 16 years then the president of the AFL CIO after it merged with the CIO for another 25 years.

posted by Linecrosser on Jun 29, 2011 at 08:36:08 pm     #  

Anniecski asks the question, "And how will those people be organized, I'm wondering, since unions' power is being whittled away with a chainsaw?"

I can tell you I've not always walked with my union leadership. I've more or less questioned "leadership" over the years. I don't talk much of it on the local blogs because of the usual naysayers scoring political points. But I can tell you the NAFTA trade agreement woke me up back in 1992. I voted for Ross Perot thinking that Slick Willy was only in it for himself. I went to Ross Perot rallies but never seen much of my union brothers in attendance back then. You see most Americans were not paying attention. Most thought what has happened could never be. Well it has happened an Ross was exactly right! I still find unions not very organized against the oligarchy that is killing the American Dream. To be fair to union leadership the membership is too complacent. They refuse to get active thinking that nothing will change. Anniecski I don't know what it will take but their has been some hope as in Madison Wisconsin this spring. Much of our media is now owned by only a few corporations, concentration of mass media control is limiting free speech that works against the average Joe. We hear the propagandists on talk radio on cable with their phony think tanks spewing a controlled message over and over on the strongest signaled stations. Just for instants scan the AM dial and how many right wing stations do you find? Now the critics will say that right wing radio sells and maybe they have a point but I think most of it is being sold with slick costly subsidized programing that is indoctrinating Americans against their best interests. Now this is a rare moment for me to speak this way on TT but I thought it had to be said.

posted by wolfman on Jun 30, 2011 at 12:57:43 am     #   3 people liked this

I supported Ross as well; he was the only candidate making any sense. Labor in the United States got shafted by King George I (NAFTA) and Slick Willy pounded the stake home (NAFTA). And, by the way, I wondered just where all those unions went when the jobs headed out of the country.

Washington politicos will tell you that those jobs are gone forever, but I don't believe that for a second. The only reason all those jobs will remain outside the US is because organized labor will allow it, and they'll do it by apathy and a lack of organization. Elect new officials who will get rid of NAFTA and support new business, and the demand for labor will go up.

posted by madjack on Jun 30, 2011 at 09:10:06 am     #  

Wolfie well said.

You may have me in years, but in my lifetime I've seen unions do nothing. I want to support a group that stands up for the American worker, but I can't support a organization that has failed over and over to anything to stem the tide. Get your shit together, stop this whole social justice charade and get to work bringing jobs back to America. I just can't stand next to Bob King & Jesse Jackson babble on about righteousness, abortion rights, and "stickin' it to the man", but I will stand next to you Wolfie if it was common sense talk about re-empowering the American worker. We don't have to agree on social issues but we can agree that the system is broken and all of us need to get together and fix it.

Jobs, pensions, health benefits are not Rights, they are things EARNED by the workers. And should be protected by the workers, even the ones who do not have a card. Most union workers are good, hard working honest people and I don't decry them from getting what was offered to them.

posted by dbw8906 on Jun 30, 2011 at 09:26:37 am     #